Faulty Motherboard or screwy CPUs?

[A31Chris]

I have a NEC Ready 9701 system for those who may not know. It has a socket 7 motherboard for the old pentium I processors. Mine has a 150mhz processor in it. Recently I bought a 200mhz cpu off ebay. Upon installing, a few hours later on startup I got a 'Not enough memory to load registry, or the registry may be corrupted.' I had the jumper settings for 200mhz set correctly. I did a complete system restore. Would work alright for a little while, but then same problem. Digging around and taking the advice of techs and such I replaced the hard drive. That didn't solve the problem. It ran fine for a while(maybe a couple of hours) but eventually would crash or on restart would give me the same 'Not enough memory to load registry, or the registry may be corrupted' message again.So I replaced the stock 200w power supply with a 250w new power supply thinking old one was bad. Nope. Still same problem. So I replaced the newer 200mhz processor with the stock 150mhz processor that it came with and did a system restore. Problem did not return. Upon inspecting the CPU I bought off ebay I could see it was cracked on its back, and it was apparent some of its contacts and connections were broken. Its like someone took a hammer to it while it was still in the original motherboard because its ZIF pins were in excellent shape.

I contacted the seller and explained to him what happened. Figuring it was a fluke I had him just replace it with another 200mhz cpu instead of refunding the money. When I recieved the replacement 200mhz cpu I inspected it for obvious damage first. It showed no apparent signs like the first one except a little white chalky stuff on its back. However, a couple hours after installing this replacement cpu the exact same problem occured. I realize the guy could of gotten a bad batch of cpu's like from a wharehouse fire or something. But now that I have put 2 in with the same problem to me that means the likelihood of something wrong with my motherboard increases. Is it possible my motherboard has a defect that is causing it to freak out at the site of a 200mhz cpu?

I now have put my old 150mhz processor back in and have a couple hours ago, just finished the system restore and my puter is once again working fine.

[104456]

If its running alright for a couple of hours before it fails then it sounds very much like a heat related problem.Have you used some compound like artic silver on the back of the heat sink when reapplying?

[A31Chris]

No I didn't put any arctic silver or anything on it. Would it make that much of a difference that fast? I guess that is what the white chalky residue is on the back of the new cpu. I've never used that stuff before. Alright, maybe I'll look into it.

[DrMDJ]

I don't think the problem is heat here. Pentiums in that class didn't run that hot and required no more than a passive (and not so good) heatsink. And thermal paste isn't really needed or usefull either. The cpu core (ie slug) is on the bottom of the processor, so the heatsink doesn't even contact it (just the ceramic casing).

It sounds more like a cpu related problem, though not necessarily that the processor is bad. I'll assume you know that in fact the 9701 will take a 200mhz processor (many in the Ready series couldn't handle processors that fast). You might want to double check the voltage settings to see if they are correct. Also, though the system may take a P200 it may only take the standard (classic) P200, not say a P200 MMX (which had different voltage requirements). So if you got a P200 MMX that might be the problem.

If you want a compatible P200 you might want to consider getting hold of one of the P200 MMX Overdrive procesors. These had their own built-in voltage regulators and were much more "friendly" upgrades in many cases.

[A31Chris]

Well, it has the jumper settings and the diagram of where to put the jumpers for the different speed settings. And those settings go up to 200mhz. It doesn't(the manual) say much about exactly what type of 200mhz processor is compatible, or if it is compatible with the ones I'm putting in. But it does specifically mention the Pentium Overdrive. I'm looking through the book now and it doesn't really elaborate on what kind of processor upgrades you can use. It just has info on removing and installing new ones. I'm trying to find the Pentium Overdrive reference I distinctly remember reading. Yeah, here it is right on the System Processor first page. :Adding an upgrade processor, such as an Intel(R) Overdrive(tm) processor. This is the only hint in the entire book as to what kind of CPU I can use in my Ready system that I've ever found other than the processor speed settings. . This is why I assumed I could upgrade to any 200mhz mmx processor for a socket7 motherboard since my mobo says Socket7 in big letters on it. I didn't realize there was so many different d**n types. Could my motherboard have gotten damaged from putting in the wrong processor? It runs fine with the original CPU in it.

As for the voltage settings, it only shows a picture of where they are at on the motherboard. It says DO NOT ALTER, or touch or some similiar message. So I've never messed with them.

OK, I"m going to try to find somewhere on the net that sells 200mhz mmx Pentium Overdrive processors and try that. If any of you folks know of any links to places on the net that still sells 200mhz mmx Pentium Overdrives, please throw them my way. Wish me luck.

Chris

[A31Chris]

I looked it up on the net and my systems stock processor is a 150mhz Pentium Pro. So maybe it isn't MMX compatible although the Phoenix BIOS recognized the MMX when I put it in.

OK, I found this site.
Overdrive Processors for sale Can someone give me advice on whether these would work for my system? And if they do would I have to alter the voltage settings? Are these processors MMX compatible and what exactly does MMX do?

This find is rather intriguing.

Chris

[Rapmaster]

Ya those overdrive things do work, I've seen them.

But........ you are paying more for them than the system is worth (even what it would be worth with the upgrade.)

A place near where I live sells entire Pentium 350 systems (no monitor/keyboard/mouse though) for $70 Canadian... which is about $50 US. (They come from government surplus auctions.) Dell Optiplex GX1s I think.

[markp62]

The 200MMX has a CPU IO voltage of 3.3v, and the CPU Core voltage is 2.5v, known as a Power Split CPU.
Your P150 has a single setting for CPU IO voltage at 3.3v.
Your motherboard may not support a dual voltage processor.
The Overdrive is a single voltage.
MMX is an improved way to handle multimedia applications.

[A31Chris]

Thank you all for your help! You guys have really helped me increase my understanding of things. I am just going to find a 200mhz Pentium Pro. Thats all I really need for now

Actually paying the price that link is suggesting to me is worth it. I wouldn't be able to get another 300mhz system for $49 dollars. Maybe sometime a few months from now I'll grab that Overdrive thingy. Right now I just want 200mhz so I can play Tribes decently.

Once again thank you all for your help. You guys are great!


Chris

[DrMDJ]

As I said, the Overdrive processors are self contained units that take care of the voltage issues (as Markp62 said, the mmx processors use a split voltage design). It is specifically designed as a (basically) drop-in upgrade. I would advise sticking with no more than the 200mmx overdrive though on your system as that is likely the highest speed one your system can handle. I would also stick with the Intel made ones as these tend to be the most compatable with systems (companies like Powerleap, Evergreen Technologies and Kingston Technologies also made these overdrive upgrade processors).

[A31Chris]

I was browsing the net last night and I was at Aloricas website, the company that has taken over support of NEC computers. Anyway, digging through the back forums I found the link for the motherboard diagrams and schematics for my computer. These schematics have instructions for setting the voltage settings to accomodate MMX processors. I am so p***ed right now at the jackasses at NEC who wrote the docs for my computer. They're fired, all of them, FIRED!:


Here is a link for the manual if anyone is interested.

NEC Ready 9701 motherboard manual

[cleaverb]

Note
The row of 5 jumpers for the core voltage (JP16/14/12/7/6) need to be set all at once. Short pins 3-2 for MMX CPU, pins 2-1 for non-MMX.

Short JP15 for MMX, open JP15 for non-MMX Pentium.
check your jumper settings, got this off the jumper page:

http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/BCM/fm567/567JMPRS.asp

maybe you tried that ?

I usually put a fan/heatsink on my 200mmx. Seems like I have had that error message before, can't seem to remember now.

The Triton III VX chipsets were/are finicky about memory. There were
only a couple choices- 32MB or 64MB Ram DIMMs.
( I say that because it is hard to put more IC chips on a DIMM)
In a nutshell,
the motherboard could only recognize 2MB(4MB?) chips on a DIMM.
Has to be low density.Basically, that is memory that each IC chip on
the DIMM stick is 2MB. So if the stick had 16 ICs, 8 front and
8 back, it was seen as a 32MB, even if it was actually 128MB
at a higher density. If you put a high density stick in, and it only
sees 32MB, that would lead to memory errors. Okay, now somebody explain this to chris, in english .
Actually, i had a single sided 8 chip DIMM that was 64MB and
was seen as 64MB , it's marked as 4X64 density SDRAM.
but forget the numbers because I am sure that I typed this in wrong,because I did it from MEMORY ...

[A31Chris]

Yeah, thanks for the advice. I tried my own link and it seems the website has changed. Before that link took me right to my mobo manual. Now it pops ya up on some motherboard site. Funny thing is last night I decided to save to disk the page with the jumper setting instructions on it. And the next day the website was gone! How's that for lucky?

Anyway, I've set all the jumpers for the new voltage and have processor speed jumpers put at 200mhz and have the processor in the computer now as I type this. Taking it for a test run if you will. Wish me luck.

Um, I am not sure what they mean by 'all at once' if they mean all in the same pin switching session then thats obvious. If they crazily meant that somehow with the tower shut off and unplugged it can somehow affect things to not change them all instantly and simultanously then noone has probably ever gotten a 200mhz processor to work in one of these babies before.

Do you guys think I need to put that quicksilver stuff on the CPU? Dr. MDJ I believe it was mentioned that it doesn't put out that much heat that a heatsink couldn't take care of.

Anyway, thanks to everyone for their input.


Chris

[cleaverb]

I use thermal paste when i install them. The paste helps
insure a good contact between the heatsink and the CPU,
which improves the transfer of heat out of the CPU.
Locally here, I can buy a small tube of 'generic' paste for
$1.00 , and usually if you buy a new heatsink fan, they will
have some small packet of paste included. The amount of
paste needed is about the size of a drop of water, .
Intel recommends something in the area of a coating that
is 10 microns thick. Thinner than a piece of paper(pardon my physics). Just enough to fill in any 'imperfections' of the flatness
of the surfaces. You can put more, except it tends to turn into
a sticky mess when it gets warm. IBM applied it liberally.
***(The rest of this post is my facts and opinion rolled into one.)***
The 200mmx were possibly the coolest running pentiums
ever made. The 2.8 core voltage was probably going to be
great for mobile computing,and offered an upgrade in speed
for the socket 7 motherboards. (Alas, the Pentium II was
either on the market, or shortly would be, and some consider
the pentium 200/233 to be a marketing decision. IE , another
less expensive upgrade, as compared to a new PII )

[Murf]

Dr. MDJ is correct 200Mhz does not get that hot and a heat sink will dispurse the heat build up. If you have some paste it could only help it, just a very very small amount. Otherwise I would not worry about paste