Odd Hannging Problem

[Aussiblue]

It's an HP Pavilion 6305 (AP) 256 MB Memory W98 SE. The problem has come and gone (for a week) over the last month and seemed worse since the last MSN upgrade. It seemed to temporarily fix itself for a week with the third last McAfee update so I thought it might be a McAfee problem but it's back again.

It has started freezing randomly (no keyboard response) and usually only a power switch off will fix it. When I run the Amidiag (American Megatrends) diagnostic DOS based program yesterday it also hung the first two times at two different points (said Winmodem was faulty and the CPU was a 36 Mhz processor instead of 366. and then froze) Third, fourth and subsequent attempts it ran OK. I ran the advanced DOS based diagnostics in batch mode all day and it worked fine did not freeze and found no faults.

It also seems to run OK if I can keep it going for and hour or so without doing anything ie boot up and leave Windows desktop open and open no programs. However if I do otherwise and I reboot 101 time after 101 freezes it keeps playing up.

All this seems to point to some hardware problem; something that works OK after its been running uninterupted for a while but I am open to suggestions.

It also seems to have excessive activity after windows is loaded and the desktop opens but CTRL,ALT, DELETE Norton CrashGuard and various bits of software that show the running processes reveals nothing new. MCAfee virus scan has found nothing. While I have Zone Alarm Outlook came up with a popup yesterday that said a program was trying to access my address book and that worrired me.

I have tried reinstalling McAfee, Outlook, IE and MSN but there has been no change. Also ran SFC, Win Doctor, Speed Disk, Reg Clean, etc etc. The CPU and Power Supply fans are spinning and ambient temperature doesn't appear an issue (dies hot or cold)

My next move will be dismantle it and reseat every board and chip etc. Next will be to but a new CPU and Motherboard but if it will have to be cheap at the moment; I'd rather wait to get a fast setup but if its the CPU or MB that at fault my current liquidity will mean a bargain basement barebones 1500 Duron and PChips MB.

[Aussiblue]

Oh something I just thought of:next try will be to use my old rescue disks to see if a month old version makes any difference. Will try after I log off and report back if I have any success.

[ralph3124]

Before doing anything drastic, get rid of Norton CrashGuard. IMHO, that is an unstable product that (in other threads I have read) MAY cause problems like you encounter.

Hope this helps.

[Miz]

I agree with ralph3124...disable Crash Guard, run the computer for a few days and see if the problem disappears.

The concensus among geeks and techs who know far more than I is that Crash Guard causes far more crashes than it prevents.

[fink]

"The concensus among geeks and techs who know far more than I is that Crash Guard causes far more crashes than it prevents"

Yup. It has been suggested, only half jokingly, that Crashguard was secretly developed and inserted into Norton's CD's by their main competitor, Mcafee, to make Norton look bad. It succeeded, lol.

[Chuck Mielke]

Here's a WAG for ya. Try removing the Modem card and see if you still have the problems.

QUOTE:
It also seems to run OK if I can keep it going for and hour or so without doing anything ie boot up and leave Windows desktop open and open no programs. However if I do otherwise and I reboot 101 time after 101 freezes it keeps playing up. [UNQUOTE]

There seems to be a little fractured syntax in that last sentence. 101? Playing up?

Computers are strange and weird. - I think the problems most of us have with stuff like this is related to hardware, or software, rather than the computer itself, or the OS.

Also, I am one of those who have had bad experiences with Norton Crash Guard.

[Aussiblue]

Tried the modem removal trick but still hangs. Last crash destroyed my user profile and all my saved passwords and put Virtual Dr on the blocked cookies list so I had some fun getting back here to post a reply. The PC Chips MB has a built in moden so I guess if I go that way I can do a few modem comparison tests.

Nortons CrashGuard has always behaved itself for me but I have killed it to see if it solves anything.

[fink]

"While I have Zone Alarm Outlook came up with a popup yesterday that said a program was trying to access my address book ..."

I overlooked that when I read it the first time.. it's probably worthwhile to do an online a/v scan here to be double sure that you don't have a virus lurking in the background..

http://housecall.trendmicro.com/

[Aussiblue]

Thanks while I have McAfee installed and I check for an update each time I log in and I have run it's online scan it's worth trying another source.

[Aussiblue]

Well I left it conncted to the 'net and running the Trend Micro virus scan overnight and it didn't hang and no viruses found. I need to do more to find what crashes it. After reading the PCChips Mobo reviews I've been put off that option.


PS: Can someone tell me how to remove the extra "n" from the post heading; it's annoying and will make it hard to find it again with the forum search facility.

[Aussiblue]

After running reliably all not doing the virus scan and working from 6 am (Perth West Australian Time) it died at 8:00 am exactly. How does one tell if ones dial up ISP is pulling the plug on you? Would this cause the system to feeze? I also had a problem that on boot up Outlooks sound had gone but on third reboot they reappeared; weird.

All the freezes/crashes seem to happen when CPU usage is at max if that's relevant. The CPU fan and it an its heatsink are working and firmly attached.

[fink]

Reseating sound an video cards, which you said you were going to do, will mean reinstalling drivers which would have been the next thing I'd suggest. Also running in safe mode for a few hours to see if that makes a differnence and could point to something running in the background causing the problem.

I've never seen being disconnected by the ISP causing a freeze but you never know.. try setting up your email program to check more often (every nine minutes) to show more activity on line so the ISP doesn't kick you.

[Aussiblue]

OK I seem to be making some progress. The much maligned Nortons has its uses. Its seems something is running periodically in the background. Not all the time though; it seems to stop from 2 am to 8 am. User resources will suddenly plummet for know or obvious reason and if I have a few windows open already this locks the system up. If I just leave the machine on and touch nothing it will do this every 30 minutes or so.

I have both Lavasofts Ad Aware and Spyware Blaster but I suspect something is sending something somewhere. Perhaps a legitimate program where I have switched some polling arrangement on and forgotten as there appears to be no virus. As whatever it is runs for less than a minute then closes I can't find it if I look at running processes. Any ideas of how to track this down.

There is nothing that shouldn't be in startup unless something illigitimate has renamed itself as one of my long standing start up programs. I have Zone Alarm, Tclock Ex, Best Power, TweakUi, Startup Monitor, UPS/CheckUPS II, 3D Savage Balster Video, Nortons Image, McAfee, Nortons Cleansweep, Nortons Protection, my MS track ball, Hp printer scheduler, MS keyboard and the onboard Crystal Sound installed as Start Up programs.

Yes a bit I know; but its always been there (plus other thinks like Norton Crashguard which I have taken off).


Also now have Max Memory in an attempt to avoid the freeze (doesn't seem to help so it will go).

[Paul Masley]

Aussie:

In looking over your last post, I suggest that you disable TClock, and all of the Norton Group. You may have a raging war going on between Norton and McAfee. Norton progs have an inherent problem of setting their own times regardless of what you want. This may be causing your disk activity.

Also, if Norton is doing a virus check and McAfee comes on line, one might be trying to out do the other.

Try this. This will take some time and will require a lot of reboots.

Take you computer off line (disconnect the modem, so you do not get any viruses), run msconfig and diable everything there except for Explorer (including systray), look in you sys and win files and rem anything with "Load" in front of it and then reboot. Once you reboot check what started (<Ctrl> <Alt> <Del>).

The only thing that you should see is Explorer. If so, load it up with a program that will tax the system. See it it will lock. If no lock occurs, enable each program in msconfig, one at a time until the lock occurs. Now remove the first prog that you enabled and see if the lock occurs. If no lock happens, then you found it. Go through each program. You will eventually find it.

Pau.

[Aussiblue]

I don't have Nortons Anti Virus and only have the McAfee antivirus software and they have together OK up to now. I am also reluctant to turn of the UPS software as it often crashes without it (everytime the washing machine or freezer switches). I am working the other way at this point eliminating several or single start up program one at a time and seeing what happens. I guess I will work down to zero and then back again.