[RESOLVED] Computer delays re-start after shutdown

This is kinda wierd and just recently started. My computer runs fine but when I shut it down like in the morning when I leave for work like I usually do and come home in the evening and hit the start button nothing happens. A couple of times I hit the power switch on the strip and then immediately hit power and it started. And then that didn't work either.

Oh did I mention that after a few minutes or an hour or sometimes three after hitting the power button the comp comes on by itself and then runs perfectly. It seems to be getting longer and longer before the computer starts so I'm now leaving it on all the time till I get a solution.

I've checked all internal wire connections etc. and the power button itself still has the little "click" when I hit it and doesn't seem to be the problem.

About four years ago my power supply was fried by a power surge and my technician replaced my 350W PWS with a 250W PWS model. I complained and he was supposed to get me another 350W but never did so I'm 50 watts below the recommended minimum for my MB. But it's never acted up in all this time till oh about six weeks ago when it started acting up.

So is it my power supply or something else? How do I find out? Would it have anything to do with that little button battery on my MB? My computer is about seven or eight years old now and it's never been replaced.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Try a different outlet, and without the power strip as a test. I'm betting that you need a new power supply though.

Link:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817153023

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Originally Posted by jdc2000

Try a different outlet, and without the power strip as a test. I'm betting that you need a new power supply though.

Link:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817153023

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Different outlet is not an option, I only have one on this side of the house and it checks out ok.

As to the power strip I'm sure it's not the problem, the first thing I did was put a new power cord from the power supply to the power strip and changed to a different outlet plug when I did that. I also have a printer, phone, speakers and a small fan (only used in summer) I use for aux. cooling of the cpu none of which is giving the slightest problem. It has a very heavy cord and it is a relatively new power strip/surge protector. when I say relatively new I mean it's about a year old and not a cheapie.

I'm kind of leaning to the power supply thing my self, but why doesn't it give problems when the computer is actually running? I've never had one do this before.

Thanks for the reply.

1 year is enough time for the capacitors in the 250 to weaken and we must take into concideration the adition draw needed when the computer starts up.

I have yet to see a 250W power supply that was worth anything. Post the brand and we may have further info on it.

The power supply brand is FSP Group Inc. I was looking at a Coolmax unit at Mwave.com for the good price of $16.99 for a 400W unit. I can't afford to spend much right now would that be a good enough unit to buy?

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Originally Posted by Train

1 year is enough time for the capacitors in the 250 to weaken and we must take into concideration the adition draw needed when the computer starts up.

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Actually it's the power strip/surge protector that's a year old, the power supply itself has been installed since about Oct. '05

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Originally Posted by rythymace

Actually it's the power strip/surge protector that's a year old, the power supply itself has been installed since about Oct. '05

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It has done right well but still, it is time to replace it.

That power supply is so cheap it really scares me.

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Originally Posted by Train

It has done right well but still, it is time to replace it.

That power supply is so cheap it really scares me.

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Check it out here and tell me what you think, they have some really good prices.

The price is low, but personally, I wouldn't touch that Coolmax PSU with a 10 foot power cable. The one I listed has 2300 reviews with a 73% 5 egg rating and is only $32 with rebate, plus it is from a highly rated manufacturer. I have used quite a few of those myself to replace junk stock PSUs.

Use the one jdc listed.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817153023

If I remember right, we had a party lose a mobo with that one you listed a while back.

I absolutely hate rebates that make you jump through all sorts of hoops and fill out forms and get them in correctly, especially for just ten bucks. My feeling is that you sell the product at a reasonable and real price and don't hassle your customers with paperwork and long wait times for a check. I regularly boycott companies that engage in that type of marketing and refuse to be a part of it.

Thanks for the recommendations, I probably won't buy the Coolmax but I need something with a better price than the Thermaltake which I know is a premium brand. If this 250W cheapie hasn't blown my MB in four years I doubt it's gonna blow if I put in a medium grade 400 watter. I'll look for a better brand with some good recommendations.

I'm gonna go check out Best Buys online and see if they have any deals going, I'd rather put money into the product than shipping and handling anyway.

Mwave.com has the Thermaltake for a cheaper price than newegg . If I can't find a better deal on a decent unit I may get this one from them. Just have to find a way to scrape up a few more bucks.

THERMALTAKE W0070RUC

There you go.
After 10 years, there are some brands I would not wish on my worst enemy.
Here is a link to my favorite ps.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...8791&name=XION

Learned how good they are when two 250000 volt lines slapped together.

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Originally Posted by Train

There you go.
After 10 years, there are some brands I would not wish on my worst enemy.
Here is a link to my favorite ps.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...8791&name=XION

Learned how good they are when two 250000 volt lines slapped together.

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Interesting you mention that as that's what happened to me. Tree experts were removing trees outside my house and dropped a limb onto the power service lines to my house which were improperly insulated at the entrance point and fried everything electronic on one side of my house. Power company paid to replace everything including my refrigerator, microwave etc and of course my power supply which unfortunately was done by a dishonest repairman.

Question; My MSI board says it requires a minimum of 300W for the power supply. I notice that one you like is 650, is there a maximum I should watch out for? Don't want to overdo it. But I don't do stuff that requires a lot of power anyway.

Not sure that Xion would work for me with the fan on top, there are no vents in the top of the case above where my PSU goes. There are some in the middle and toward the front but not above the PS.

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is there a maximum I should watch out for?

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No. It just means you have more headroom to add devices.

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Originally Posted by Midknyte

No. It just means you have more headroom to add devices.

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As Midknyte states plus the PS is not working as hard.

Ok thanks guys, that's good to know. Also I found that thermaltake PS on Amazon with free shipping for $41.28

Good luck!
:D

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Originally Posted by rythymace

Ok thanks guys, that's good to know. Also I found that thermaltake PS on Amazon with free shipping for $41.28

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Power supply - 300 or 600 watts - work just as hard. Most computers hardly consume more than 200 watts. So we add more than sufficient margin with a 350 watt supply. Now a standard 350 watt supply is also marked by some third parties as a 500 watt supply. Are they lying? No. They are just measuring something different. So many who know nothing about electricity will hype 600 or 700 watt supplies on a classic myth: more watts mean a more robust supply.

Worse, some 600 watt supplies are even missing functions that were required 30 years ago. They need not provide it since the law says you are responsible for having some of those functions.

Now, did you know all computers have a power supply controller? How curious. Your symptoms discuss functions of a power controller. (Also ignore myths about discharging capacitors.) A problem that may be seen using one minute, a 3.5 digit multimeter, and an inquiry on how to identify the problem long before replacing, buying, or disconnecting anything.

Thanks Westom, Train and the others who helped. I think I've resolved my problem.

I did not have enough money to order the Thermaltake and I didn't like the unit Best Buys had for $50 so I called a local computer repair shop I had done business with before (not the idiot who installed the 200w PS) and he had a unit for $29.00 so I went up and bought it this afternoon and have it installed and everything seems to be going great so far. '

For the first time in weeks my computer actually started when I hit the start button, instantly and without complaint or just sitting there staring at me.

Don't know how you guys will feel about the unit I bought but at least I have someone local to take it back to if it fails or if it every fries my MB.

What I got is a Logisys 480W Dual Fan 20+4 ATX Power Supply.

The store I bought it from has been in this area for years and years selling new, used and refurbished computers and doing repair work and have a reputation for being good so I hope I got a good PS.

Thanks again everyone for your time, now I have to see if I can remember how to mark a thread "Resolved". :)

[quote]The store I bought it from has been in this area for years and years selling new, used and refurbished computers and doing repair work and have a reputation for being good so I hope I got a good PS.[/b]

Nothing wrong with that route, I have used it myself. Never have dealt with that brand, but I sure hope it holds out for you!

[QUOTE=Train;1313618]

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The store I bought it from has been in this area for years and years selling new, used and refurbished computers and doing repair work and have a reputation for being good so I hope I got a good PS.[/b]

Nothing wrong with that route, I have used it myself. Never have dealt with that brand, but I sure hope it holds out for you!

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Thanks Train, so do I ! Would have liked to have the Thermaltake but the dollars just weren't there the $30 for this one was a bad enough hit to take this week but I didn't want to delay any more either getting that old one out of there.

computer actually seems to be running a step faster, don't know if it's just perception or reality but it seems so.

Your Welcome. And the heck of it is, it just might be running faster since it now have all that it needs.

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Originally Posted by rythymace

I did not have enough money to order the Thermaltake and I didn't like the unit Best Buys had for $50 so I called a local computer repair shop I had done business with before ... and he had a unit for $29.00

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To contain the many functions required in any supply (even 40 years ago) means its retail price starts at $60. To sell a supply at less price and sometimes higher profit, many manufacturers 'forget' to include these functions.

They can do this because so many assume, "it works - therefore everything is OK". For example, a required filter is missing as indicated by interference to AM radios. Or another function is missing so that the supply may damage other computer part long in the future.

What happens when the supply causes motherboard or disk failure. A majority then *know* any power supply can damage other computer parts rather than learn why human failure caused that damage.

Routine is for a defective supply to boot and run a computer. Then months later, strange intermittent failures occur.

Well, this is how we learn. Fixing something is never enough. Learning means also discovering why that failure happened. This is where your future experience might teach something. But only if you appreciate what was described here.

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Originally Posted by westom

To contain the many functions required in any supply (even 40 years ago) means its retail price starts at $60. To sell a supply at less price and sometimes higher profit, many manufacturers 'forget' to include these functions.

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Man, no offense but that's just nonsense. There are so many more complicated electrical components you can buy for $60 or less I can't even name them all. VCR's for example not only have to have a power supply but digital readouts, complicated pullies and gears and a channel tuner and you can buy them all day long for $39-$49.

Also I just got through a four year stint with a 250w PS in my comp that probably cost $10 and there's nothing wrong with my computer as a result.

The Thermaltake PS recommended by Train can be had from Amazon for $34.00 and he and others here have long experience with them being good units so your assessment seems a little "alarmist" to me.

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Well, this is how we learn. Fixing something is never enough. Learning means also discovering why that failure happened. This is where your future experience might teach something. But only if you appreciate what was described here.

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I'd appreciate it much more if the person doing the describing sounded more credible.

He just worded things , where I just pointed out the better brand.


Pick up 2 PS and if one feels like it weighs a fon, that is the one I would probably use.

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Originally Posted by Train

He just worded things , where I just pointed out the better brand.

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Maybe, he just came across to me as more wanting to lecture than giving any helpful information.

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Pick up 2 PS and if one feels like it weighs a fon, that is the one I would probably use.

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That makes a heck of alot more sense than putting an arbitrary price of $60 that must be spent to get a good PS. Prices are just too volatile these days and some really good electronics can be had for really good prices if you know where to look.

And any company that buys electric parts in bulk can build the best PS in the world for around $15 per unit. The retail price depends on who you buy from and how much profit they want to make and how many middle men there are and a whole ton of other stuff. It just makes no sense at all to me to put an arbitrary price of any amount and say that's what you must spend to get a good unit. I may have been born at night but it wasn't LAST night. lol

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Originally Posted by rythymace

And any company that buys electric parts in bulk can build the best PS in the world for around $15 per unit.

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That $60 was the retail price. Yes, supplies can be obtained in mass for lower prices - just like apples.

Appreciate the numerous complex functions inside every supply. It does more than just provide power. Many power supplies selling at retail for $25 or $35 are missing some essential functions.

Why can they do this? Why can they sell supplies that, for example, violate FCC requirements? Because they are not responsible for meeting those government regulations. Many do not understand this. You are responsible if that supply violates FCC, et al requirements. Many $29 supplies can be missing essential functions - such as a circuit so that the supply can never damage other computer components.

Did you know a powered supply can must have all outputs shorted together and never be damaged? Another required function. Intel even defined how big that shorting wire must be – and no damage.

Power supplies are complex devices. Amazing (due to generations of refining) are how so few components do so much. A power supply is a wonderfully complex device. Many never learn how complex, flexible, and robust a power supply must actually be.

Free market forces define a fully functional supply at $60 retail. Obviously, that does not mean a $100 supply has all required functions. But to sell a minimally functional supply for $29 means somebody in the manufacturing or distribution chain is taking a loss. Or, more likely, functions required in a rather complex unit (a power supply) are missing. A power supply missing essential functions can still boot a computer.

The power supply I bought;

Complies with FCC part 15J class B 115Vac Operation and CISPR22 230Vac Operation
Meet UL 1950. CSA 22.2 Level 3 Requirement
Over Voltage protection
Over Power protection
Short Circuit Protection
100% Hi-pot & Function (Chroma)tested
100% &Burn-in under high Ambient Temperature(50¡ãC)
Low Noise and Ripple
Energy Star Efficiency
Window 7 compatible
link

I don't really get what your point here is other than trying to make me feel stupid for buying a supply you don't approve of and at that you're failing. This forum is for helping people with problems and so far all you've offered is a bunch of sermonizing and lecturing. The power supply was already bought and installed before you came into the equation so why didn't you toddle on off and torture someone else? I'm quite sure millions of people yearly buy supplies for less than $60. You must be losing a lot of sleep if this bothers you so.

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Originally Posted by rythymace

I'd appreciate it much more if the person doing the describing sounded more credible.

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A least credible person tells you what to think. Never posts facts or defines important numbers. Meanwhile, others think the least credible are those who never provide anything without the always required reasons why.

Some see credibility in their feelings. Others see it only with numbers. For example, if you tell me something and provide no facts and numbers, then I must conclude you are lying. Others - a majority - find no credibility in facts and numbers.

Your choice. How many here designed power supplies? Well, one who did and you then concluded he was least credible? Why? Notice how many facts were provided that are not common knowledge, based in technical knowledge, AND that can be confirmed from other sources.

For example, did that supply come with a long list of numeric specs? If not, that is a first indication it is missing essential functions including those listed in the first post. Few know what any of those numbers say. But when specifications are not provided, then the 1% or 5% who actually know this stuff cannot provide any advise. Only speculation becomes a recommendation.

The least credible source makes claims without numerous reasons why - and numbers. A majority often do not understand that simple technology concept. A majority have virtually no idea how complex a standard supply must be. The specification sheet should be a full page.

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Originally Posted by westom

For example, did that supply come with a long list of numeric specs?

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See my previous post we were evidently both typing at the same time and I'm pretty much done here except to say that I"m not a mind reader and I don't see your electrical degree in your sig so I had no evidence you were "credible" or not. And I'm pretty much done here.

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Originally Posted by rythymace

I don't really get what your point here is other than trying to make me feel stupid for buying a supply you don't approve of

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Why make assumptions on what was never stated? What you feel is not relevant to anyone - and has no logical purpose posted in a technical discussion.

If you told me what to buy and did not give me reasons why, then I must conclude you were lying, were technically naive, or were promoting a scam. No emotions. Just logical conclusions. Provided for you (and more important many others) were numerous reasons why that $29 supply might be educational. If you choose not to learn, then read no more, posting nothing, and go away. But if not stated, then you (and the many others here) had no facts to learn from.

Either you go away and post nothing because you did not want to learn. Or you appreciate, for example, that a power supply is a wonderfully complex device doing things you did not even know were required.

Some specifications are always required in every supply. Specs that also must be provided with numbers and in writing. For example, some supplies only use .6 out of every 1 watt to power the computer. Waste .4 watts. A number that violates international standards. And a number that makes supply design more complex.

Noted was who is responsible for that supply meeting, for example, FCC regulations. Did you know that? Most do not. Some would like to know that. If you don't, then just go away - say nothing. Then that was only relevant for the 99 others who want to learn.

Nobody - neither you nor I - have any obligations or interest in silly emotions. This is a technical discussion about power supplies. Not about how you feel. Appreciate, for example how complex sophisticated a power supply really is AND you did not know that. How some reap even greater profits from a $29 supply - that may be missing essential functions.

Is your supply missing essential functions? Obviously I did not say. But power supplies selling for $29 retail can reap higher profits by missing essential functions AND still boot the computer. Yes, a defective supply can still boot a computer. Also not commonly known. And also a technical reality. If you don't like that, then do not post. It was only posted for the benefit of others who would learn from a public discussion. How you feel was never relevant. Whether you want to learn from your supply venture is your choice. Posted was the opportunity. Only those with credibility also post the reasons why AND the always required facts and numbers.

Meanwhile, those same facts and numbers get others emotionally upset. I will never understand why. And apparently you will not say why. So I learn nothing from your emotional response.

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Originally Posted by westom

Why make assumptions on what was never stated? What you feel is not relevant to anyone - and has no logical purpose posted in a technical discussion.

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I was not the only one making assumptions. You assumed your "expertise" and lecturing were desired even after my problem was solved and my thread marked "resolved". Maybe you are so highly educated you are unskilled in the social graces and do not realize people do not like being lectured to.

If you want to lecture then find the appropriate venue and let those who desire to be your students sign up for your courses. The purpose of this thread was to determine what was causing my computer to not boot it was not to invite a treatise on the proper and necessary functions of power supplies and which ones should be bought.

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If you told me what to buy and did not give me reasons why, then I must conclude you were lying, were technically naive, or were promoting a scam. No emotions. Just logical conclusions. Provided for you (and more important many others) were numerous reasons why that $29 supply might be educational. If you choose not to learn, then read no more, posting nothing, and go away. But if not stated, then you (and the many others here) had no facts to learn from.

Either you go away and post nothing because you did not want to learn. Or you appreciate, for example, that a power supply is a wonderfully complex device doing things you did not even know were required.

Some specifications are always required in every supply. Specs that also must be provided with numbers and in writing. For example, some supplies only use .6 out of every 1 watt to power the computer. Waste .4 watts. A number that violates international standards. And a number that makes supply design more complex.

Noted was who is responsible for that supply meeting, for example, FCC regulations. Did you know that? Most do not. Some would like to know that. If you don't, then just go away - say nothing. Then that was only relevant for the 99 others want to learn.

Nobody - neither you nor I - have any obligations or interest in silly emotions. This is a technical discussion about power supplies. Not about how you feel. Appreciate, for example how complex sophisticated a power supply really is AND you did not know that. How some reap even greater profits from a $29 supply - that may be missing essential functions.

Is your supply missing essential functions? Obviously I did not say. But power supplies selling for $29 retail can reap higher profits by missing essential functions AND still boot the computer. Yes, a defective supply can still boot a computer. Also not commonly known. And also a technical reality. If you don't like that, then do not post. It was only posted for the benefit of others who would learn from a public discussion. How you feel was never relevant. Whether you want to learn from your supply venture is your choice. Post was the opportunity. Only those with credibility also post the reasons why AND the always required facts and numbers.

Meanwhile, those same facts and numbers get others emotionally upset. I will never understand why. And apparently you will not say why. So I learn nothing from your emotional outburst.

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Facts and numbers I have no problem with. It is arrogance and condescension I detest and people who give lectures uninvited.

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Originally Posted by rythymace

I was not the only one making assumptions. You assumed your "expertise" and lecturing were desired even after my problem was solved and my thread marked "resolved".

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Honest technical facts are always desired. But not by you. So please leave if you do not have anything to contribute. Emotions are not relevant in a technical discussion. Provided were facts for many others who want to learn technology. Not provides are logical reasons for your outbursts. Topic is about power supplies and computer restarts; not about you. Unless you would explain why technical facts - the underlying reasons why - make you so angry. That is also (now) relevant.

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Originally Posted by westom

Honest technical facts are always desired. But not by you. So please leave if you do not have anything to contribute. Emotions are not relevant in a technical discussion. Provided were facts for many others who want to learn technology. Not provides are logical reasons for your outbursts. Topic is about power supplies and computer restarts; not about you. Unless you would explain why technical facts - the underlying reasons why - make you so angry. That is also (now) relevant.

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I know what the topic is, I'm the one who started it and you are off topic and out of order with your lectures. It's my thread YOU Leave. You contributed absolutely nothing toward solving the problem that started this thread and there was absolutely no purpose for you to jump in AFTER I had bought a power supply to tell me which one I should have bought. You're like the guy who when you ask him what time it is he tells you how to build a watch. The facts are accurate and even interesting but NOT what was asked for and you seem to be totally oblivious to the fact that people do not like being lectured to unasked. Go start your own thread if you want to lecture on power supplies.

OK folks, let us just let thing be.