Building computer for first time...

As I stated in my previous post, my son is into gaming, namely World of Warcraft. He is going to build a computer from scratch. I'd like input on the configuration. I know it could be much better, but we're trying to keep the cost down while making sure it's a viable gaming computer. Please let me know if there are major incompatibilities or if any of the hardware has known problems. After much research, here is what we've come up with:

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Price $219

Graphics Card: We're going to try to use what we have - Radeon X800 256mb

Motherboard: MSI KBN Neo4 SLI Price $123

RAM: ATRIX CSCI-G8022C-C43 Price $90

Hard drive: Maxtor DiamondMax 10 6L200S) 200GB Price $91

Case w/480 watt power supply: ATRIX CSCI-58022C-C43 Price $52

Sound Card: Creative Labs Sound Blaster Live! 24-bit Price $29

That's the main stuff. The prices are just what we've found. That, of course, could change daily. Thanks!

I don't know if your graphics card is PCI-Express or AGP, but if it's AGP that that motherboard won't do. If the graphics card is PCI-Express then that's fine, but then you'd probably have to get a different power supply, the chances are that it won't have the 24pin ATX motherboard connecter. Most PSU's that come with the cases have ye olde style, a 20pin and a 4pin connector.

Also, most PSU's that come with cases don't tend to be very good, so I would suggest getting a quality PSU that will provide steady voltages and won't go bang any time soon.

The graphics card that we already own (Radeon X800 256mb) requires just a regular PCI slot, which I think is available on the proposed motherboard. Let me know if my thinking is sound there...But we want to be able to upgrade to a PCI-E, which is also available on this motherboard. My thoughts are that if my son wants a better graphics card, he can save his money and buy one himself.

The power supply that comes with that case gets very good reviews from buyers, but if it gives us problems, can we upgrade that down the road without causing any damage to the other componets?

Also, I have been really concerned about the connections. Should I expect the wiring and other hardware to to be included with either the motherboard or the other components?

I am new at this and look forward to any guidance you can offer. Thanks for responding!

Not sure, but don't think the x800 came in PCI ... AGP yes. So best make sure of what you've got there before ordering...

I'm in the process of building a few machines and here's what I'm putting together ....... for comparision purposes. All hardware & prices from Newegg.com

EPoX EP-9NPA+Ultra Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra ATX AMD Motherboard - $105

SAPPHIRE Radeon X800PRO 256MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card - $199

Antec TRUEPOWERII TPII-430 ATX12V 430W Power Supply - $70

AMD Athlon 64 3000+ Venice 1GHz FSB Socket 939 Processor - $139

CORSAIR ValueSelect 1GB (2 x 512MB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) - $78

Western Digital Caviar SE WD2500JS 250GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - $98

So let's see ... you're at $604 & I'm at $689 ..... I didn't include a sound card because I'm going to use the onboard sound... but I've got a decent PCI-E video card in my list... And I dare say I think the hardware in my list is a tad higher end than yours. Not a contest here, just stating a fact... and giving you some ideas.

So your video card thing there is something to look at before you buy ... and, if you want to go PCI-E then do it... ;-) Also, you have an SLI motherboard there ... SLI is an Nvidia thing and requires the purchase of two video cards to work in tandem. It's a good thing and works ... but is that where you are going in the future? And the SLI mobo will generally cost you more.

K8N4-E Deluxe
http://usa.asus.com/products4.aspx?l...54&modelmenu=1

Ooops...I just realized I put the wrong description on RAM. It should be 1GB Corsair ValueSelect DDR400. I'm still researching the information given in the last two posts. I'll get back soon. Thanks for the responses!

Train, that's a socket 754 motherboard. If anyone is building an Athlon 64 system right now, I'd definately recommend getting a socket 939 motherboard.

Ditto....Socket 939 option: http://usa.asus.com/products4.aspx?l...96&modelmenu=1 A8N5X

Liam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by David Harrison

Train, that's a socket 754 motherboard. If anyone is building an Athlon 64 system right now, I'd definately recommend getting a socket 939 motherboard.

---

So would I!

After further research and considering your comments and suggestions, I think we will order these components to build a low-cost gaming machine that has the ability for upgrades. Please let me know if you see any conflicts or incompatabilities in this layout. I hope my son and I will be putting this machine together Thanksgiving week!

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Price $219

Graphics Card: Radeon X800 256mb Price $189

Motherboard: MSI KBN Neo4 SLI Price $123

RAM: 1GB Corsair ValueSelect DDR400 Price $90

Hard drive: Maxtor DiamondMax 10 6L200S) 200GB Price $91

Case w/480 watt power supply: ATRIX CSCI-58022C-C43 Price $52

Again, I appreciate your help!

jr

O.K., I'm gonna hang in there with ya..... but need a few more specifics really. Here's what I'm seeing ...

The Atrix case and power supply for $52, I see it here (I think) for $49.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811209018
That's all well and good, not familiar with the product so can't say...

The motherboard you mention is a K8N ... not a KBN. Might sound picky but we hardware folks are picky that way. ;-) Don't know if you need or want SLI ... the EPoX motherboard mentioned in my earlier post is cheaper and a better performer than the MSI. Here's a roundup of NF4 Ultra motherboards for your viewing pleasure ... http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2465

The video card ... so, you're buying that??? As opposed to using the same model you have from your earlier post??? Need more info ... the Radeon x800's are many.... if it's a plain x800 why not go for the x800pro for $10 more? And then there's that SLI thing again ... if you're buying an SLI motherboard and a video card to go along with it then it should be an Nvida card so you can take advantage of SLI at a later date.... If you're not going to do that then it makes no sense to buy an SLI motherboard which adds to the cost.

Now let's talk hard drive ... I believe that Maxtor you're talking about is a SATA drive... SATA150 to be specific. In my list I had a Western Digital for $7 more ... it has an extra 50 gig and is SATA II ... that's 3Gig/s, it's fast... and a SATA 2 capable motherboard to take advantage. I believe the MSI board does have SATA2, best to get a hard drive that uses it.....

Late now so have spewed enough... ;-) laters.....

Thanks for your patience and persistence, Abhoth. I think it finally sunk in. Ignore the previous configurations and check this one out. I still have some questions about the hard drive. But here goes the configuration...

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Price $219

Graphics Card: BFG 7800GT OC Price $383

Motherboard: MSI K8N Neo4 SLI Price $123

RAM: 1GB Corsair ValueSelect DDR400 Price $90

Hard drive: Western Digital Caviar SE WD2500JS 250GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Price - $98

Case w/480 watt power supply: ATRIX CSCI-58022C-C43 Price $52


I was previously considering 3 graphics cards. We own one, were considering a new cheaper one to avoid spending big bucks on the GeForce 7800GT. Due to your pesistence, I now realize that to be able to utilize the SLI features in the future, we need a specific type of graphics card. I hope this configuration makes more sense to you.

Now, the hard drive: I need to do some more checking into SATA II. The motherboard info I have found does not say specifically that it supports SATA II. Let me know what you found.

Thanks again for your work on this.

jr

The way I see it there is no need for SATA-II yet, SATA will be more than enough for a while yet. Even the fastest SCSI drives can only maintain a constant transfer speed of about 100MB/s, and SATA allows for a transfer speed of 150MB/s (1.2Gb/s).

If you want a fast HDD then get a WD Raptor, it spins at 10,000rpm and is able to achieve higher transfer rates than drives that spin at 7200rpm, however they cost a lot more and I'm not really sure how much improvement you'd actually see. I'm sure it'd load games a bit faster, but probably only by a couple of seconds, if that. I was considering getting one for my operating system drive, then I saw the price...

Another point to consider is do you really need 250GB of space? Windows and any programs will only take up around 10GB at the most. Games will take up more space, but I would have thought that an 80GB drive should be more than adequate, unless perhaps there's a lot of download going on.

I have found in the past that installing Windows onto a SATA drive can prove to be troublesome, in most cases it will require installing the SATA controller drivers during the Windows install. My last motherboard had the drivers on a floppy disk and it was fairly easy to install them, however I'm not sure about that motherboard. It may be better to get an ATA HDD, just for simplicities sake.

Thanks for all of your help. We are going to go with the last configuration posted with a possible exception on the hard drive. I think we are going to go with a SATA drive and hope my wife can work thru the software instalation issues. She is really good at that (with the help of you guys on this board)! And it probably will be the Maxtor 200GB, but that extra 50 gig would help with editing church video stuff.

I am somewhat concerned about the stability of our cheap powersupply, but when trying to do a "cheap" computer, ya gotta cut somewhere and we definitely gave in on the video card (nothing cheap about that one)!

Again, thanks for all of your comments and advice...with my wife's help, I hope to order the components before the weekend! (Since I am off tomorrow!!)

jr

I wouldn't go with a generic PSU supplies with a case, it will most probably die a messy death a lot quicker than a decent one would, it would be worth the money in the long run to splash out now.


Liam

When a power supply dies, does it hurt anything? Or even possibly hurt anything? Thanks!

jr

You'd have to hope not, I had one fail a while ago and everything was fine, but if a PSU dies then depending on the way it fails I guess it's possible. Hopefully there would be a safety guard in place so that it wouldn't fry your bits and bobs.

However, even if it failed safe and just cut power to the PC, that isn't really good for the PC anyway, so things could still go wrong.

I have had a PS died and it took out the cpu, mobo and floppy drive.

I just thanked my lucky Stars that it did not take out anything else.

I've had PSU's take out an entire system and sometimes just itself. I think quality PSU's have protection built in, to not damage any other componets, but I'd rather not take the chance ;)

A good Surge Protector helps.

Well, my son and I got the components in and put them together and turned it on. Amazingly, it recognzied everything. My wife took over and she and my son loaded xp. They had a little trouble formatting the Maxtor drive, but after a couple of tries, they were able to load xp no problem. My son has been gaming almost non-stop all last week. He had to drag himself out of bed this morning to go back to school. The machine is running WOW very well and that is all we are interested in at the moment. He reports it consistently runs at 60 fps at a temp of approximately 40c.

My only concern is the RAM. When it boots, its says it is 333 RAM when we paid for 400 RAM. Next time I crack open the case, I will look at the sticker on it to see if it indicates whether its 333 or 400. The plastic case it came packated in does not indicate if it is 333 or 400. I may need to change a setting on the BIOS. After I check it all out, I may need your guidance, but for now, I just want to thank you for your posts and guidance. Our first attempt at a non-Dell machine is a success!!!

jr

Congrats on the "birth" of your new baby!

Go into the BIOS and see if there is a setting for "optimal defaults." If there is, activate it. Otherwise you can probably set the FSB manually for the RAM. You may not see 333 & 400MHz listed, but 166 & 200; choose the 200 setting in that case. Has to do with DDRAM as opposed to SDRAM. Optimal defaults should also bring the CPU up to full speed if it isn't already (200 x 11 multiplier).

Nice feeling firing your own creation up for the first time, isn't it! :D

I have had them die and take out nothing, I have had them die and take out the video card. Another one died and killed the hard drive. They can take out everything or be selective in what they destroy.