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Hi!
Re: System State
I'm using Windows 2000 and the Backup utility, ntbackup.exe has a friendly interface and wizard which both easily allow you to backup the system state by clicking on a checkbox. I've never tried scheduling it using command line parameters.
It backs up a load of system files (takes over 200MB on my setup). Very handy to have this to hand when Windows tries to die on me. A quick Restore operation and everything can often be well again!
Best wishes,
Andrew
Ahh, the NT version of windows Backup.
Only drawback with the ntbackup program, I think, is that you have to reinstall W2K to be able to perform the restore operation in case of a complete system failure...
Hi GreenGoose1 n Everyone else, To Iterate (if that's the word)
First off, when I tried NTFS n Put XP pro into my System I had all kind of Probs, had to Format again....Then it went ok but my ACDSee started to play up, + iPhotoPlus4, n one or two other progys....Then my Card Reader, cause cards are Fat16.....So that really peeved me orf......Re-Formated once again n XP played me Up......SO...I cursed badly n decided to put in WinME & Install XP Pro straight over the Top, n stayed with FAT32, Had No Probs...Did All the Tweeks etc n it has worked Great.....That 80Gbt HD caused me probs, so i took it to the lockal comp shop, It Peeved them off so they decided to put it to NTFS, i told em they would have probs, no one took any notice, anyway HD was a bad un.....Put in New un did NTFS n still had probs, so I said Enough is enough , took it Home, Downloaded "MAXBLAST" n did the darn thing myself but in FAT32....That was nearly 4 months ago n System is going Great...Fingers Crossed...lol...So I'm put off with NTFS for now......Bios is also updated, but i did not do, too chicken..LOL.....So Confidence is too Blown to use NTFS at Moo...
Hope ya could All follow that....lol
Glad to know DRMDJ is OK.....Thanks......Dennis..
Hi all,
After reading Virtual Dr for many months I finally joined, so please forgive any future mistakes made in ignorance. I've come to recognize many of your names and have learned much from all of you. This thread has been an excellent read and is what finally prompted me to register.
Ok, now to display how little I know. From what I've read so far here's what I've gathered I need to do: I'm running XP Home SP1 on a non-partitioned 60 GB drive (because when I got it, I knew little about partitioning,) with no (gasp!) back-ups. I also have an old, non-functioning machine that has (had) W98 running on it. It crashed last year and was in the shop for a week before they said they couldn't fix it. I'm ready to wipe the two hard drives in it and install one of them in the newer machine. Then buy Norton Ghost (seems like the most popular here,) ghost my C drive to the newly installed one and wipe C clean. After that, re-install XP, partition (number and sizes of each to be determined,) and then move stuff back into it. OS into one partition, programs to another, data to yet another and music to a separate one also. Do I have that correct? I'm also running Spybot, Ad-Aware, Spyware Blaster, ZA Pro and AVG.
A couple of questions: How do I determine if any programs I have need to be on the same partition as the OS? Do I need a separate OS on the second h/d or will the ghosted image be adequate? (Told you I don't know much, but I'm learning all the time.) Thanks again for an excellent resource, I've recommended Virtual Dr many times to friends.
Caroline
Hi Caroline, welcome to VirtualDr :)
That sounds like a good plan. You don't need an OS on the second partition, just the image file. You can run Ghost from a floppy disk to restore the image after you've wiped the original drive.
Basically you can install programs to any partition you like with the vast majority of apps, but a few just don't give any choice in the matter. Some others insist on at least part of the installation going on the OS partition (in the case of Visual Stusio .Net nearly 1 GB :( ). But that is the only restriction, what the particular app will actually allow.
Hi Caroline, welcome
You might want to look at Partition Magic 8.0 also. That way you can resize that hdd partitions without all the fdisk and format rom DOS stuff. And if you hdd is in fat32, it will resize the clusters as need for the partition size.
Good plan you have and the addition of PM8 will save you a bunch of time and hair pulling ;)
Hi All, Had to leave for the day. Family duties and all that.
Hi Always Lernin' and welcome to VirDr and the Delta Threads. You seem to know something from how you wrote up your issues.
:)
If I may make a suggestion, get the older computer running too. In your new machine two HDDs.
Now on partioning, your hard drives have tracks on disks (up to 6) which when when partitioned divides up electronically the space (tracks) on your HDD into what is called drives. With the newer and bigger HDDs you usually get a floppy with them that will boot up your machine and prompt you through the whole process. Then you can ghost back what you saved.
This is just a brief overview of what you will do. When you have questions large or small ask, as none are dumb nor will anyone poke fun at you. Know why? We all started at the same point. and there are a number of older members who helped me and still help when I have a question or two or 202. Makes no difference. All are here to learn or help or both. Some absolutly fantastic people here to get to know. Again welcome and I hope you get more than what you expected out of this experience. :) :)
scarecrowdr, Wow terrible experience, more than one problem at a time. But if the hard drive had not been bad. What then I wonder.
We seem to have a pretty good cross section of what people have and do with regards to Maintenence, Back Ups, and Security.
So on to the fun part. But first does anyone have any questions concerning any of the Apps we have talked about? Now is a good time to ask.
After any questions I will post an initial generic program of Maintenence, Back Ups, and Security to start us off and then you all can tear it apart and put it back together, insuring we have the best posible product. We will use the FAT 32 file system on this one followed by one using NT.
Then by that time would be a good time to generate the how tos on each utility program. This will give the newer people a road map of sorts thus saving them more time than some of us did. As always any questions will be answered as they are asked. Any suggestions on this approach to make it better?
Hello again and thank you for the warm welcome.
SuperSparks, it's good to know I won't need a second OS and that I shouldn't have any problem separating the apps.
Train, thank you for the Partition Magic suggestion. I've read of the program and thought it would be a good investment. By the way I'm using NTFS.
Greengoose 1, perhaps I know a little - very little. These issues have been floating around in my head for a while but your thread really helped them come together into a cohesive plan. I would love to get the old machine working but have been unable to. It starts up but crashes very soon after. I can't reload 98 since it was a second hand machine and I have no discs.
First step though will be to change out my cd drive. Forgot to mention earlier there's something wrong with mine but I have a spare. Once I know that was done correctly, get the second HDD in there as well. This will be my first time really tinkering with the physical insides and just getting those things accomplished will be something. When I can, I'll purchase Partition Magic and Ghost and figure out the partition sizes I'll be needing. This is gonna be fun!
Thanks again to all...Caroline
Welcome Caroline,:) you hit the nail squarely on the head! It's the 'fun' part that keeps me building these funky boxes. trials? yes,,errors? fer shure,,but with a' bit of fortitude and the help of the great people here, a day will come when you can say: See? this is 'my' computer,and i built it 'myself'!
If you'd like some basic stuff to look at, here's a' couple of sites that helped me get started way back when.
http://www.howstuffworks.com/category.htm?cat=Comp
http://www.waterwheel.com/Guides/how...therboards.htm
Pretty basic, but can help a' bit regarding the 'hands-on' when assembling a PC...
Just thoght I would share my 'newcomer-to-tinkering' xperiences
You mnow, it wasn;t long ago before I started tinkering with the inside of my PC. I was terrified at opening it up, coz I imagined a box full of circuitry and wires, sparks and everything (even though I had seen the inside of a pc b4!)
But, I had just bought a DVD drive and I had to hook it up meself. No buts or questions, I had to do it if I wanted to watch my DVD's. So I took off my cover, just to find that inside my case it is actually pretty empty compared to what I had imagined!
So anyways, I cleaned out all the dust, took out the blanking plated (careful in there, lots of sharp bits!) slid it in, screwed her tight, hooked it up and bingo...didn't work.
Turns out I had the cable wrong , master to slave and vice versa.
Now I open it up just to clean it out, and soon I will be building my own pc...the plans have been laid.
Once I had taken that initial step, everything so much less daunting. And although building my own pc from scratch is quite a biggy 4 me, i suspect once i have done it i will be slapping myself for wondering what i was nervous at in the 1st place.
At the end of the day, its all good fun. If we didnt enjoy it we would be here right?
Thanks for reading all...
GP:)
Good Morning All,
gizandpop, That is a good example of what all go through in getting started with computers. Nice.
Always Lernin', Ridgerunr gave you a couple of good references that can help out on specific subjects.
One thing at a time, but the old computer may not need anything more than a good disk cleanup, scandisk, and defrag. You get alot data scattered around on a hard drive and you will have crashes.
Your "bad hard drive" may just be fouled up and need a little TLC
(tender loving care) in the form of some maintenence. You never know until you go through it and check 'er out.
Now onto the subject at hand. To set up a computer with a good Maintenence, Back Up, and Security plan, you will need some third party applications. And you have to know how to use them. When we buy a computer you need two components, hardware and software. And in your soft ware is an operating system and maybe some optional additional little programs. This is all setup and then the requirements to get on the internet are met and away we go on our computing fun.
Then something happens to the computer down the line. It does not work. In checking the hardware seems ok but no joy. The software maybe fouling things up bigtime because of a hard used hard drive (maintenence required), can't find and access data you know is there (no back ups), or your computer won't act right or will not do things correctly or refuses to work (security breached and a virus at work).
This shows that something needs to be done in addtion to just operating it. Most operating systems have built in apps that will allow to clean up some problems. But third party apps designed for specific jobs are available that are freeware or you buy.
I submit the following to you as one way to accomplish taking care of your computer in regards to Maintenence, Back Ups, and Security in a Fat 32 environment.
For Maintenence
1. A disk cleanup. Most computers operating systems have it.
2. Scandisk. Or what your OS has.
3. A defragmentation program.
Back Ups
1. Save complete system and burn to disk by using Ghost, Drive Image or other utility program. Save to another hard drive, external drive, external tape drive. Have more than one backup.
Security
1. Zone Alarm
2. Grisoft AVG
3. SpyBot
4. Adware
This should get us started on a setup that anyone could use and depend on. As I said earlier, all of you can tear into this, break it down, add to, comment, whatever, and only one requirement. And that is to make it better.
Have fun. :) :)
Where can I find ScanDisk on WIN XP PRO? Tried under systems tools, not there...
Chkdisk instead of Scandisk on XP. I looked into ChkDisk on another project and there is not much to it seems to me. Mainly what chkdisk does is to check directories and FATs for descrepancies. What use it has in NTFS, I do not know. Maybe someone else can enlighten us on that point. :)
Striaght from M$ TechNet:
And an example of what it 'checks' on an NTFS file system:Quote:
Chkdsk examines disk space and disk use for the file allocation table (FAT) and NTFS file systems. Chkdsk provides information specific to each file system in a status report. The status report shows errors found in the file system. If you run chkdsk without the /f command-line option on an active partition, it might report spurious errors because it cannot lock the drive. You should use chkdsk occasionally on each disk to check for errors.
Checking an NTFS disk
Windows displays chkdsk status reports for an NTFS disk in the following format:
The type of the file system is NTFS.
CHKDSK is verifying files...
File verification completed.
CHKDSK is verifying indexes...
Index verification completed.
CHKDSK is verifying security descriptors...
Security descriptor verification completed.
12372 kilobytes total disk space.
3 kilobytes in 1 user files.
2 kilobytes in 1 indexes.
4217 kilobytes in use by the system.
8150 kilobytes available on disk.
512 bytes in each allocation unit.
24745 total allocation units on disk.
16301 allocation units available on disk.
So I am gussing it has its uses in NTFS. That said, someone with a bit more knowledge is gonna have to expand on that for me.
1:D
GP;)
Hi!
Chkdsk seems to be a decent enough disk checking utility and can be used to do a surface scan too.
You'll find on Win2000/XP that you have to reboot to actually start the Chkdsk process as it wants exclusive access to the partition which it can't do whilst Windows is running.
One of the beauties of NTFS is that it keeps a transaction log of what actions it has to do to the disk which aids recovery and is meant to make disk corruption far less likely. It also means that the system can easily flag whether the particular partition is in need of a scan or not on each bootup.
Best wishes,
Andrew
This might be an interesting read... its good ol' M$'s advice or maintaning your HDD's
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/tre...b_cnc_jmmb.asp
GP
Interesting. I guess I'll have to activate a NTFS file system and take a look at that abit more. :)
Added to this post from TechNet:
Use the Chkntfs command to determine whether volumes are flagged as dirty. Daily Running Chkntfs can help you identify volumes that have file system errors. If a volume is flagged as dirty, Windows XP Professional runs Chkdsk when the computer is restarted. You can, however, run Chkdsk immediately or postpone Chkdsk by using the Chkntfs command, although it is recommended that you run Chkdsk as soon as possible. To assess the damage without repairing the volume, you can run Chkdsk in read-only mode.
If I decided to run defrag overnight, and closed all programs that were running (which would include ZA Pro) would I be at risk of an attck, even though I am not actively using my broadband connection?
Hi!
Just a note on the chkntfs command.
If you run it with the switch /D, then that restores the default behaviour of scanning any drives flagged as dirty on bootup.
More reasons for NTFS:
It dynamically remaps bad clusters.
It has the ability to limit access to files by user/group. Also the ability to audit who accesses them too.
Supports file encryption or compression.
It has multiple copies on the disk of critical data structures to prevent data loss should one get damaged.
There also isn't the same cluster size issue seen on FAT drives.
Unless you need a Win9x OS to be able to access the files on your partition, then NTFS is the one to go for!
Gizandpop, if your broadband connection is open, then keep your firewall up too or else you are at risk.
Best wishes,
Andrew
Gizandpop... just disconnect the cable from the PC to the modem.
You can then turn off the firewall. That's better than simply turning off the modem because some cable ISP's regularly ping their customers modems to test connectivity.
Just use PM8 to convert it. Don't take long to do.Quote:
Originally posted by greengoose1
Interesting. I guess I'll have to activate a NTFS file system and take a look at that abit more. :)
Of course to find the chkdsk errors and what was done to fix it, you have to be in admin mode.
To find the files you have to be able to see the system files. To do that I R-click the Start button and select Explore.
Explorer open, then go to Tools in the menu and select Folder options.
Select the View tab.
Under "Hidden files and Folders"
Put a check in "Show hidden files and folders"
Drop down to lines and take the check out of "Hide Protected system operating files (Recommended)
Apply and ok out as required.
Go to Start, search , files and folders, use Found.* to locate them. I believe I remember that right.
Now the chkdsk does take of C: on a reboot, but the other partitions and hdds can be done while in Windows.
It is not as robust as scandisk, but seems to get the job done. Want to have a bit of fun. Use diskedit and make some crosslinked files, then run chkdsk.
THEN Read the Found* reports afterward.
EDIT: When I run Check disk (chkdsk) , It converted some files as hidden folders names FOUND000 and FOUND001 that all containing files in extensions as File0001.chk. File0002.chk, File0003.chk, File0004.chk and so on up to hundreds of files.
These can be deleted and if you wish to read them, it can be done using notepad.
Good day all,
Ridgerunr, thank you for the sites. I didn't know of Waterwheel and it looks great. There simply isn't enough time in the day to do all of the reading I want to. (Can't one of you tweak something somewhere and make a day last 48 hours? Only the one's I'm not working though!)
Gizandpop, it's the thought of tinkering with my 'good' PC that makes me a little nervous, but I know the precautions to take and once I get in there, I'm sure I'll be fine.
Greengoose, I did run Chkdsk on the old one a while back (I think that's what it was) and that was fine. I'll certainly defrag it though (searching my brain for the old DOS commands.) However, I know you want this thread to be about maintenance and not computer repair and building so....
I run Chkdsk and defrag when I think of it (once a month or so.) Backups, well that's my issue at hand, getting some done. After a couple of months of research and trying different firewalls, I settled on ZoneAlarm, then bought the Pro version because I thought it was deserving of some money spent on it. AVG, Spybot and Ad-Aware are run every couple of days (nothing serious ever found.) In addition, Spyware Blaster and Browser Hijack Blaster are always running. I believe I'm a little more security conscious than the average home user, perhaps due to all of the reading I've done on the topic (I've been called paranoid more than once!) but so far it has paid off. I'm generally happy with how my system runs, although it'll never be fast enough. Once I get this back-up issue solved, I want to turn the third machine into a sort of test site, since I love to try out new apps. (Aside - my brother has told me I can have his machine, since he's out of the country for a year working, but I haven't been able to go get it yet. Of course, then I'll need a router to get it on-line and I have no idea if it has an ethernet card in it.) That was off-topic again, sorry.
Will check back in again later...gotta do some mundane things like shop for food. Thanks again everyone, learning tons here!
Caroline
Ref: To Found.*
To locate the folder, go to my computer, open C:\ and once you have system files and folders unhidden you can see the folder.
Another thought on security is the user themselves. Use sites that are known and don't open Email except those you know. The only thing you can't control are the EMail attachments to the Emails and if you open one with a virus - but that can be averted by scanning them. One other point. A new virus most times does not have a fix in place. (the Virus has to be anyalized before a fix can be programmed.). In other words wise use and where you surf using your computer can and will keep you out of trouble. :)
All this talk of chkdsk has reminded me of something else - I added some switches to my boot.ini file (it's a hidden system file in the root folder of C:, so you need to set your Folder Options accordingly). It can be opened in Notepad, and it's a good idea to make a backup copy of it before modifying it.
Adding " /sos" without the quotes after " /fastdetect" will show the drivers being loaded during boot, and even better gives a very quick check of all volumes during boot and if it finds a problem will allow you to run chkdsk/autochk there and then.
Adding " /bootlog" will create a boot up log which can be used to indentify any boot problems. It's called Ntbtlog.txt and lives in the %systemroot%\Windows folder in WinXP or %systemroot%\Winnt folder in Win2000.
Adding these switches only adds about 15 seconds to the boot time. Here is a copy of my boot.ini from my XP machine as an example:
[boot loader]
timeout=20
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /fastdetect /sos /bootlog
C:\CMDCONS\BOOTSECT.DAT="Microsoft Windows Recovery Console" /cmdcons
Changing the timeout=30 , default to 10 makes a nice difference too. As long as you are not multibooting.
What is the timeout value for?
In a multi OS boot situation, it gives you time to select which OS you want to boot to. You would be surprised how fast 10 seconds is in that situation.
The timeout value is how long the mutiboot screen will display for before the default OS starts to load. Of course if you press the Enter key before that value is reached then the OS loads immediately.
"Great Thread..."
My Maintenance and Backups...
Scan system for viruses once a month (Norton AV 2003, auto update)
Run and update Spybot S&D once a month.
Run and update Ad-aware 2 to 3 times a month.
Run and update SpywareBlaster once a week.
Clean the Registry around 3 times a years or after a heavy list of recent un-installations.
Compact the Registry about twice a years.
Defrag the HDD 1 to 2 times a month (Diskeeper)
Clean out temp files, trash or any other useless trash 2 to 3 times a month.
Empty Cookies once a week.
Scan Disk, once a year.
Install Windows Updates, twice a month.
Backup all important files once a week with "easy-Backup" onto a Zip Disk. (e-mails, addresses, Favorites, Quicken, RoboForm PW...)
Backup all files (exe, zip) that I've downloaded once I reach a limit that will fit onto a CDR disc. (images, mp3's)
Windows XP Pro (OS)
Good Morning All,
Hi Fuelm@n, Nice write up. Liked the "what you do and when you do it" style.
Several threads could be started from what we have in the thread as we have touched on related subjects. In reading this thread over there is much similarity and many differences in what is done conerning our subject on Maintenence, Backs Ups, and Security. The existing material gives any reader a really good starting point to learn and find out what is best to use or start another thread.
With that in mind, I think probably from your responses and what has been said or not said that we should move on to our next subject. We will start that tonight so as to give readers a chance to ask any remaining qustions or add anuthing more. :)
Ready and waiting!
My friends on the Delta & Stuff - thank you very much for all the inputs, it has been very educational. Cheers:D
Love that avatar alkader
Ghost Ghost Ghost, GET GHOST :D
Hi everyone, just stopping in to see what's been added. During the week it's busy for me but I'll be sure and stop by each day at some point.
I'm certainly looking forward to what's coming next, it's been extremely helpful so far.
I'd be interested in hearing if you have a favourite, free clean-up utility for things like temp files, etc.
Thanks in advance! Caroline
DeltaX and Hard Drives link :D
Always Lernin'
Those who use DOS based OS;s have Deltree to use if they which chose. I do and that way I know exactly what the outcome will always be when I bootup/reboot.
Hey, this is just the greatest, I have just fineshed reading through these posts because I stumbled over them on "search" looking for info and answers to my current situation.
I have win98se and have been "foolish" cleaning house, and guess I deleted something I should not have, anway after 7 BCOD's, I decided to upgrade to XP (see my post upgrading to xp) and found out that I need extensive additions to my system, so this "delta thread" is providing me with a lot of help and explaining some things that I had mever considered nor would have though of. Such as partitioning the hd's, their size and what to put "where". A lot of information on other utilities and ther uses"s. I have really paid attention to "oldhermit, big john and 5/6 other's on what they have and their maintenance programs.
Thanks to ridgerunr and one of his prior post I have been doing maintenance on a weekly basis. But dispite this my system has been getting slower (both bootup and shutdown) with constant "errors and bcod's).
I am glad that I found !!! this thread and am going looking for the others that are mentioned. Hope there will be a little bit of indepth information on some more items that I am doing.
Thanks to all of you, there is much knowledge to be had and used here