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I hope I described that connector correctly and I think I did as I was talking to someone with a 286 machine who told me he had one of both type connectors on his ribbon for the floppy connections.
AlaricD, there is a good picture that you posted on page one that shows the type of connector I'm talking about. Am I not calling it correctly?
Ok, that's the cable that has the connectors we use today, and still has the connectors that would fit on the card edge of the 5.25" drive. If you compare the connector to an ISA slot, you can see how they are similar. And if you compare the card edge on the back of the floppy drive to an ISA card, again, you'll see a similarity.
http://www.pcguide.com/ref/fdd/fddcable.jpg
The cable pictured may be a bit harder to find nowadays but they're not impossible to find.
When I hear "spade connector" I think of the old 300 Ohm dipole TV antenna wire, and the two little spades that each went on a different screw on the back of the set.
Good, we are on the same page. Do they make a cable today that has one of each on it. I was able to buy the old style 9 pin video connector cable at Radio Shack so that in turn got me thinking about the possibilities here. :)
Well, like I said in my previous post, they're not impossible to find. I don't know if they're still being made, maybe there's just so many stuck in a warehouse that they'll never run out...Quote:
Originally posted by greengoose1
Do they make a cable today that has one of each on it.
That 9-pin EGA video cable also makes a really nice serial mouse extension cable...
(And for the musicians-- don't spend big bucks on a 5-pin DIN MIDI extension cable-- just get an AT keyboard cable. You really don't need much in the way of cable to carry a 1KHz signal...)
Now all I have to do is wait and see if I can find anything in the next few days or so that I need.
Which DOS OS is the best to use on this machine? :)
Ordinarily, I'd recommend DR-DOS, but you're going to need a 286 or higher for it (maybe they included some real-mode 80286 code in one of the critical files.)
MS-DOS 6.22 should run on that machine, if you have at least 360KB of RAM.
To save disk space, you can safely delete the files listed in this kbase article: MS-DOS Setup Installs 80386- and 80486- Specific Files
You could also use IBM PC-DOS or Free-DOS.
Floppy and IDE Ribbon Cables: http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp...gr-cbl-fdd-ids
Ribbon Cable: http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp?itemno=gr-ribbon (use "34 CON"ductor for FD)
Card-Edge Connectors: http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp?itemno=gr-ide10 (use "IDE34" for 5.25" FD)
Socket Connectors: http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp?itemno=gr-ids10 (use "IDS34" for 3.5" FD)
IDC Connector Crimper: http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp?itemno=HT-214
Floppy Connector Adaptor: http://www.jdr.com/interact/item.asp?itemno=DRIVE-EDGE (plug a 3.5" FD into a 5.25" FD connector)
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ST238R: http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/...ll/st238r.html
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Standard PC storage devices and I/O connector pinouts: http://stason.org/TULARC/pc/pc_io.html
Vernon,
Outstanding resources in your last post. Between you and the rest of the others that have posted the pieces of the initial puzzle are starting to fit together really well. And I thought I knew how to search things out.
But I do know cables and how to make them. That also means there's more modern day tools and cabling supplies. Which means that within design parameters there are a whole lot more possibilities for "trying stuff out".
This just made my day. Saves me time which I need to do as there are a number of projects on the agenda right now.
This also means there are alot of computers besides present day computers still operational and require parts maybe. If it works why get rid of it. Hmmmm.
One other thing, the book on DOS from the library is really helping to gain an understanding of the movement of data through a system as well as how to use it (DOS).
:)
I don't know... Maybe if people took the time to learn about computers, to understand how they work, to understand operating systems, they wouldn't be in such a mad dash to upgrade.Quote:
Originally posted by greengoose1
This also means there are alot of computers besides present day computers still operational and require parts maybe. If it works why get rid of it. Hmmmm.
If someone asked me what sort of system should they get to:
- Get on the internet
- Capture full-motion video
- Use speech recognition software
- Play quality games
- Work on home finances
- Burn CD-R's
- Play .MP3's
I'd recommend they get a 486DX-40 with 32MB of RAM, MS-DOS 6.22, and Windows for Workgroups 3.1 or 3.11. A Pentium 100 with 64MB if they want to go "all out."
What I find puzzling is that many people find DOS to be difficult. The heirarchical file structure just seems to blow their minds.
Well, post a HOW TO FOR US DUMMIESQuote:
Originally posted by AlaricD
I'd recommend they get a 486DX-40 with 32MB of RAM, MS-DOS 6.22, and Windows for Workgroups 3.1 or 3.11. A Pentium 100 with 64MB if they want to go "all out."
What I find puzzling is that many people find DOS to be difficult. The heirarchical file structure just seems to blow their minds.
I have a 386, have the 6.22 and 3.1, can get a isa nic and will pull the modem. I use cable. Have tried to find tutorials, but . . .
Besides I had heard all the horror stories in 1982. So retired instead of messing with it. Yep , before the internet was civilianized :D May even get the 486 fired up.
Some links would be appreciated.
Oh found a recycle pc again. www.repc.com and they have a Internal 2 Ft. 5.25" & 3.5" Dual Drive Floppy Drive Cable. $2
I'm going to take a stab at what you just said AlaricD. I think you hit the nail on the head.
In present day if you buy a computer with all the bells and whistles where does one start if they have no knowledge to speak of. You get maybe two manuals that really do not interface.
You don't really know that there is a bit of maintenence you can do and a few tweaks to keep your computer running well either. The industry then is really not user friendly. The what, why, how where and when are not there. The help sites and forums then fill in a very needed function. To teach people.
To do work on a computer requires programs that require an operating system that requires hardware to make it all work together. Without any one of these things nothing works. Now what are we working with - just 1s and 0s put together in a mozaic of functions to give a certain result.
Now going back in time what does a DOS system have that todays systems have? A root directory. In DOS your fingers on the keyboard are controlling that root directory and if you can make up a directory tree within the root directory you have a pretty good idea what's happening. Todays system do not have that advantage as they are much more complex.
So today I am more of an computer operator wheras years ago I would be more of a tech. The funtions today are the same - nothing more than controlling 1s and 0s in a variety of ways so that we may store Data 1s and 0s until they are needed by us to do a job regardless whether they be graphics, word prcessing, games, or whatever.
Even XP has a bit of DOS - chkdsk for one thing.
OK then - here is a question for all to think about. How does a string of 1s and 0 get put in the correct address in storage from memory so that it can later be found, accessed, and brought out into memory to be used in a certain funtion?
This is the type of knowledge that pesent day users do not have unless then get extensive schooling on it. The computer they bought sure doesn't have it.
Just a way to think about all of this.
:)
Update. I am working with DOS on this machine. :) Thanks to all of you who helped and saved me a tremendous amount of time.
I have ordered a few parts and components and bought two packages of 5.25 floppies for 50 cents each (10 to a package). I wired in a new clock and set it. I did a diskcopy and couldn't read the copy.
Last weekend I hit paydirt at garage sales - books, manuals, hardrives, 2 5.25 floppies - tested and worked, mice, keyboards, 4 monitors, power cables, ribbon cables, 4 hard drives of 465MB, 500MB, 1275MB and 2250MB and they spin up and other "stuff". Even got a 3.1 MS users manual and an office 2000 manual. You people sure know where to look. The only goodwill I visited had nothing.
There are intermittant problems though I have to work out. The computer usually comes up on a menu screen which I can access. But sometimes after using for awhile I might get a "seek error reading drive C " or a "command interpreter fault or a disk boot failure. I took the case off once and subsequently could not re boot. Cables? MoBo? Controller? Connection? All cables were reseated and put case back on and it came up.
Am I having BIOS problems as the original battery was dead. The bios is a Phooine 8088 Promise version 2.51A. Anyone have any info on it? How do you know if it is working correctly and not corrupted.
Unfortunately, I have not found a manual on the PB 500 yet, BUt in searching I have found articles and other comments on this unit.
The upshot of this effort is I am using DOS. Learning commands and the like. It helps in learning about hardware and software in general. And there is a working "dinasaur" in existence today. I don't feel lonely any more. :D
> I did a diskcopy and couldn't read the copy. ... There are intermittant problems though I have to work out. ... sometimes after using for awhile I might get a "seek error reading drive C " or a "command interpreter fault or a disk boot failure.
I'd repeatedly remove and replace each end of all ribbon cables four or five times in an attempt to clean the contacts. I'd also remove both the floppy and hard drive controller and clean the gold contacts along both sides of the bottom edges with a pink pencil eraser.
If the hard drive is still giving you an occasional error, it could be a failing hard drive. (Given it's age).
> Am I having BIOS problems as the original battery was dead.
An 8088 with a CMOS/BIOS Setup? Be the first one I'd ever seen. Are you sure the battery wasn't just to keep the clock/calendar correct?
Up until the 80286 appeared, all the PCs I've ever seen were setup with little toggle switches or jumpers on the motherboard. (Options such as how much memory, type of floppy drive(s), color or monochrome, etc.)
Thanks Vernon, found the dip switches. That just answers a major question on the BIOS for me. Will clean the contacts as you sugeest. You don't know how many times in the fifties and sixties erasers were used. LOL Noir do I, but is was a bunch.
The hard drive does make an audible sound as it spins. 3600RPM it is. I have been into "format" on it. But it doesn't clank. Much louder than present day hard drives. If it proves to be bad what would you recommend for an upgrade. Am getting the floppy controller you mentioned. ST238r HDs sell from 59 refurbished to 95 to 135 new - I think they are new. Don't say refurbished. :)
Maybe go IDE with an 8-bit ISA IDE hard drive controller?
http://www.jdr.com/PDF/mct-ide8.PDF
And them enhance that with an additional 8-bit LBA card?
http://www.jdr.com/pdf/mct-lba.pdf
Sounds like it'd be fun to try and get it to work. :)