New Motherboard suggestions?

This club is not good for blood pressure sometimes, I think :D

OK, this is scaring me, I fear something major will crack (me, mboard, CPU or all of the above :p ). I feel the need to find a compromise (to buy some time). Here's why: It's tax season. I have multiple returns to prepare (work and personal). If I slip and ruin mboard right now, I'm going to put myself (and others) up the proverbial creek. :eek:

So PC has been running hot. But power has been goobered up as well since I had to fiddle with power strip to do a reboot. At about the same time my Power Save functions for Windows quit. I had it set to shut down after a an hour of inactivity. I'd walk in here in the middle of the night and it would be running.

So, do you think the new Power Supply will correct that? Or can I manually shut down and restart throughout the day (a pain, cause I'm on and off here frequently, but I'll do it if I have to.) Can I keep the PC cool that way without risking problems?

Can I skate for a month or so before installing the new Zalman? And just out of curiosity, what does one use to remove old thermal grease?

Fact is you could even mount a better fan on your present heatsink if you wish.

And I feel you should be able to SKATE as you stated. A daily reboot maybe required.

Removing old thermal grease/pad .
I use my thumbnail to remove the heavy stuff then 97+% rubbing alcohol to remove the rest.
Make sure it has no additives so the cpu and all are sqeaky clean when done.

Oh, Train, thank you. Skating sounds good at this point.

Would you be so kind as to recommend a 'better' quality fan? What I have on the heat sink is what my friend stuck on there 3 years ago, it's a little plastic 3x3" Glacier Tech. And as long as I'm buying fans, I noticed after I got the new power supply in that the chipset fan (2x2 gold metal) is not working. Don't know when that happened, I generally don't have my case open with power on, gives me the willies. Only did it this time to check new power supply. So I don't know if it's the chipset fan itself, the pins on mboard it connects to, or that I was supposed to connect that one to power supply but didn't. (Heat sink fan just connects right to mboard and runs, so I thought chipset fan was the same.)

New/better fans might ultimately be the best route for me while I squeeze all the life I can out of this mboard + hardware. The Zalman looks like a top of the line cooler, but they also have very explicit space requirements. With the smaller case and mboard, I measured this a.m., and best estimate it would be a close call. So I could go to the trouble of installing it (while earnestly praying I didn't break something) and then it would be too close to PSU so I'd have to undo it. (That would lead to another freak out :D )

Just an aside, I tried to get good 'overall' cooling in there (I think?). The PSU fan, rear case fan, and an add-on case fan I installed in the front a few years ago, an Antec ball bearing, want to say it's 80mm, 120mm? (It's 4x4")

4x4 = 120mm
3x3 = 80MM

Need more information off the fan if you can.
Seems it came The Overclockerz Store which shutdown.

A 3 wire case fan with a good airflow and noise ratio should do the trick.

Well, looks like I'm still in trouble here. PC was booting up, restarting, no hitches all afternoon. Just now I had to power it off altogether and hit power again before Windows would launch. I'm still getting various post codes at start up as well (75 regularly, 50 & 6B this evening). Although I've searched for awhile now, can't find the meaning. Chaintech has removed info from their site and can't find anyone else who has it.

Here are my fans:

Front of case (my add-on at 12/2003 rebuild) : Antec SmartCool 120 mm

Chipset: unknown 2 wire generic, 1 5/8" x 1 5/8" (remember now my friend gave it to me 3 yrs ago, probably obtained from a PC show). It bit the dust. Took it off, can't make blades rotate manually.

CPU: GlacialTech Bi-Sonic, DC Brushless Fan Motor, Model BS701512L 03; DC 12V; 0.15A 3 wire (blk, red, yellow).
Note: couldn't see a name on CPU heat sink, but when I saw back of CPU fan with GlacialTech logo, CPU heatsink also has GlacialTech logo. So it's a set (I thought it wasn't)

Rear fan: Antec 120mm, came with the case

Xion PSU Fan: 140mm Silent LED
(something else interesting. Newegg was selling 2.2, I received 2.0. Box on 2.0 says it has- and shows- an auto/manual fan speed adjustment with an LED light next to rear power on/off switch. Not on mine. So I have no idea what fan I got :confused: Definitely 500 watts tho.)

I am beginning to be convinced I'm playing roulette with this mother board.

Scroll down to the GlacialTech Igloo 2500 and take a good look at the clip that holds the hsf on.
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...2k3-part2.html

Then looking through the charts http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...2k3-part4.html

I think removing the hsf and cleaning things up and then reistalling is the route I would go.

Still digging.

http://www.glacialtech.com/product/socketA.htm

Found them. Can you match yours to one of the models there.

KatMac...It hasn't been mentioned yet but while you have the case open, I would suggest a good cleaning. You can use a can of compressed air to blow out a lot of the dust that can cause a lot of heat build up. The fan blades especailly need to be kept clean since a build up on the blades can drastically cut down on the ability of the fans to move air...but I would not use the compressed air on the fan blades...I would carefully clean each blade with a q-tip and some rubbing alcohol or even just water...either way will work...depending upon just how much build up there is on the blades.

I know that my next comment is late in this thread but if you are concerned about mounting the Zalman...since it will require removing the board...then may I suggest that you take a look at the cpu hsf that I use...the Arctic Cooler Freezer 64 Pro:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835185125

On my board it mounts just like the stock hsf...don't have to remove board...doesn't need a support plate behind the board....lighter that the Zalman....very quiet....good price.

But...I don't know if it will fit your board..:confused:

The Zalman's are great coolers...I was just wanting to offer you another alternative...if it will fit.:)

Train, thanks for doing all that leg work! :)

If I had to wager, I'd say it's the Igloo 2500. I think they are just showing different views of the 2500 and 2500 Pro at this link you provided. Mine has the big lever as shown on the Igloo 2500 Pro, but on the other side are the two smaller square 'hooks' as shown on the 2500. Mine has exact body colors (copper base area with grids/fins, gold colored frame that sits between fan and HS) as the Igloo 2500 (on the 2500 pro that frame piece I refer to is purple).

I don't understand the charts, but would like to. I see the Igloo 2500 is near the top of each chart. Don't know if that's good or bad :D

hi stevejr (are you related to our esteemed Steve Jones? :D ). I clean pretty diligently in there with air (thankfully the Sonata case is a breeze to open compared to some I've had), and the Sonata has a plastic front filter which I also slide a scotch brite pad into for extra filtering. Still notice extraordinary amounts of dust -enough it concerns me. For awhile I even disconnected the 120mm 'add on' fan I put in front area of the case, thinking it was pulling more gunk in than cooling. But that didn't reduce dust. (Locale could be an issue. The room the PC sits in has only cold air returns on this level of the house, so there's a lot of air movement in this room.) Yet even with my attempts at diligence, when I started pulling hardware out the other day there were some nasty hidden dust bunnies. So I did a deep cleaning this time, wiped off fan blades with a plain Q-tip. I'll do it again with alcohol, though. And thanks for heat sink recommendation. ;)

PC has been running for a couple hours now with new power supply in. I'm going to reboot into BIOS, get some temps and post back.

OK, I went into BIOS and got 'health status'. I don't know a lot about this, but lgbpop's CPU warning probably is still warranted?

PC Health Status
CPU V Core 1.63V
+2.5V = 2.67
+3.3V = 3.31
+5.0V = 5.10
+12V = 12.54
-12V = (-)12.19
Memory Voltage 2.68
AGP Voltage 1.48
Battery Voltage 2.91

Current System Temp 33c/91F
Current CPU Temp 61c/141F
Current CPU Fan Speed 3183 RPM


That CPU temp is still hovering at not good?


I have to go to the dentist now (I'd rather take out the mboard/CPU if I had a choice :D ). So I'll shut it off till later this afternoon.

Thanks again!
~Kat

Current CPU Temp 61c/141F

That line is what we are looking at. Yes it is higher than I like, it is under 67C where I hit the panic button. No, you are not near the 90C where the cpu is in danger of burning up.

Now I am using the same cpu but on a MSI KT4V mobo. So the temp being what it is says the hsf needs to be removed, the remanents of the thermal patch removed, I used Artic Silver 5 to replace it, and my temps went back down to 50C. Now if my temps had not gone down, I would have figured the heat sensor was bad.


Now I agree that the Igloo 2500 is your hsf. And what the charts showed was how well it did getting rid of heat. The higher on the chart the better it did. Beating out my old Volcano 7+ right nicely.


Now I commented on a possible Fan change, so to help you to know what to get we will look at the fan spec's for the Igloo 2520 which will meet or exceed those of the 2500.

Igloo 2520 - http://www.glacialtech.com/product/socketA_2520.htm


Type - 12 Volts / Ball Bearing [Ball bearings last a lot longer, well worth the extra cost]


Dimension (mm) - 80 x80 x 25 [the size of it in the metric system. The english system is not used anymore]

Speed (RPM) - 2.200 (±10%) [that means the fan will spin between 2,000 to 2400 revelutions per minute. Nice and slow, which means quiet. ]

Airflow (CFM) - 32.71 (±10%) [CFM - the amount of air it moves in a minute which is more than my old Volcano 7+ did. Seeing as the more air moved across the hsf, the more heat that can be removed, therefore the cooler it will run.]

Noise (dBA) - 25 .0 [all sound is measure in dBA, the higher the number, the louder it is. The RPM is a big factor in generating this noise. The high, the noisier. Believe me a fan that hits 6,000 rpm drives me nuts.]

So, if you can locate a fan that meets those requirements you have located a replacement.

KatMac...I have located some 80mm replacement fans for you. These are all very good fans and any of them would work well. I have two of the Scythe 120mm fans myself...they are the S-Flex series...and I really like them...very quiet and push plenty of air. The Sunon fans are also known to be very good.

http://www.nexfan.com/su80x80x25fa.html

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...34ab3ab8e74eb3

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...34ab3ab8e74eb3

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...34ab3ab8e74eb3

Quite often the dBa ratings that the manufacturer gives for their fans are way off but I will vouch for the very quiet running of the Scythe fans...at least for the S-Flex series of the 120mm fans that I have. I would probably go for the Scythe fan that spins at 2500 rpm...and only $6.95.

For the combination of good cfm's...low dBa's...low rpm's...these are very good choices. These are just a few that I knew about.

Oopps!! I listed one of the fans twice...sorry...here is the other Sunon 80mm

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...34ab3ab8e74eb3

The Sunon's have a higher cfm rating...so if their dBa's are close enough then they would be a better choice...I just don't know how they actually sound.

Thanks guys, very much! stevejr, greatly appreciate the fan recommendations. Train, thanks for explaining in detail, I'll print it out for future reference ;)

I didn't want to bug you all too much, so I read this 'everything you wanted to know about thermal paste' article. (Good article. It has pictures. :D )

OK, one last time, so I'm clear. I need to replace the heatsink fan only. Not the (copper) heatsink itself. However (and here's the catch - for me anyway): Train said "So the temp being what it is says the hsf needs to be removed, the remnants of the thermal patch removed, I used Artic Silver 5 to replace it, and my temps went back down to 50C".

I thought for a minute I was going to get out of this easily by just replacing the fan only. But if I'm interpreting everything correctly between the article and your quote above, Train, in order to remove/replace the thermal paste that means you want me to remove the copper heatsink with those crazy clips that I can't get to budge, yes? (Which likely involves removing the motherboard?) :eek:

Not bad instructions from what I glanced at.

It ties in nicely with AS5 instructions http://www.arcticsilver.com/ins_route_step2amdas5.html

Yes, hate to tell you that, but yes the Thermal paste will need to be replaced. Yours has dried out, has air pockets, but something is right and allowing the heat to climb. :(

I put the a little dab on the cpu then spread it using a ID card until it is paper thin. Credit card will work. Any thicker and you do not get the correct heat transfer and your temps can even climb.

Been down that road myself. :(

OK, if I must, I must. And better get that notebook put back together, for backup ;)

But I'm scared. Not to take the mboard out, but getting that CPU heatsink off and back on again without cracking anything. I found these install/uninstall instructions for GlacialTech, looks simple enough. They just push down on the clip to release. Wonder why mine won't push down...

Thanks for the help!

Nice tutorial there.

Run into that oh no you don't bit myself.
Why we recommend removing the mobo so you can see what the holdup is.

Quote:

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Wonder why mine won't push down...

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There's a righteous amount of spring tension on that clip - it takes a little bit of elbow grease to push it down. That's where the caution part comes in - don't slip.:) That's why removing the mobo is actually safer, since you can place it on a flat support surface. Trying to do this with the board mounted on standoffs can be dicey.

"Don't slip"... yikes! I'm going to be so focused on not slipping that I will slip, know what I mean? :D

I work about 500% slower on hardware than most of you, I'm sure, so can't do this till tomorrow afternoon when schedule is clear. (Took me part of Sat and all day Sunday to get power supply in. Don't laugh. I got confused by all the wires :p )

I'm back. In one piece :D

Got the heatsink off -popped right off once I untangled the mother board and pulled it out (I like my case a lot but will probably never get another one so cramped inside). I've never worked with thermal patch, it didn't look too good under there, tho. Kind of blobbed, like too much. I cleaned it all up with isopropyl alcohol (and all those fan blades, too, stevejr.)

So there I was with all the guts out, no new heatsink fan. Just the bowling ball Zalman unit - sat there staring at it for awhile. Told myself stop being such a sissy, just go for it. (Actually I didn't want to run out and get a fan.) So left the Glacialtech heatsink off and installed the Zalman unit. It's cool looking anyway (especially lit up with the blue LED) and I like cool-looking gadgets! :D I put on a very thin film of thermal patch, just enough to coat the center of the CPU, because my printout said too much was a bad thing.

Actually, the way the Zalman is set up with the brackets, it seems pretty secure on the mbrd. I must have checked measurements a half dozen times, to make sure it met clearance criteria (hard to read millimeters on a cloth tape measure :p ) There's nothing too high near it. It's close to PSU, I have about 1/8" clearance between copper 'fins' and PSU, and I hope that's kosher, it was within Zalman guidelines.

Last night temps were a cool 27/80 for system, 34/93 for CPU (huge drop!!) and cpu fan speed was 1591. I'll wait awhile this morning, after it's been on for some time, and check again. (lgbpop: I connected the little fan speed controller, didn't know where dial should be set so I put it mid range - spinning well but not noisy at all).

Hit some stupid hitches, but that was my fault. I've never messed with CPU and out of curiosity lifted lever and gently took it up just a little for a peek. That's all it took for mboard to think I put on a new CPU. So when I booted up I got a message about a new CPU, etc. Now I typically jot down my BIOS settings with every hardware change, so I have a record. And of course I can't find the sheet with my most recent ones, so had to set BIOS to "fail-safe defaults" till I find that paper.

One thing that concerned me was the way the PSU behaved. I put the Zalman in and wanted to power it up (before I connected anything else). Turned on power, dead. Changed cords, still dead. Got ticked, tapped side of case, power kicks on. Zalman lights up and spins like a pro. Disconnect power, reassemble everything else, turn power back on, dead. Took me several attempts at fiddling with it before I could power up. So far so good, I hope that brand new PSU is not glitchy.

I'm so thrilled about this! (hence my chattering) You guys are just so awesome here. Did you know that PSU and CPU are last bits of hardware I've never done anything with? So now over the years you've taught me how to change everything in my case! :) You have my eternal gratitude, and will always be my hardware gurus ;)

EDIT: Since my PC has been on for 4 hours now, I decided to check temps. Still looking great!

system 27/80
CPU 34/93

And another bonus (that I hope sticks) I rebooted twice this morning and got no post codes. That hasn't happened in ages!

So as long as the new PSU is not on the fritz, all is looking up! (Sorry to rattle on so, I'm just so happy to learn something new, it feels good! )

I'm glad to hear you got it all running nicely :) That's how we all started, with a small job like that, and there's nothing to beat the satisfaction of it. Now we need to get you building complete systems :D

Now we need to get you building complete systems

Yep, that's next on the list! (I hope to keep this one going for awhile longer, though :D )

Can't thank each of you enough for the help! ;)

Excellent temps! Sure better than 61°C.

I knew you could do it.;)

I almost forgot: After a few successful (glitch-free) startup & shutdown cycles, go back into the BIOS and enable Optimal Defaults so that your computer runs at its intended speed.

Whoopee!!! Well done.!!!

I know what you mean about checking the connections over & over...that's what I did when I built my current system....I would make a couple of connections...read the instructions...again...check that connection...read the instructions...again...:o :o

Well, now that you are hooked....what's next??:D

Thanks for all the high fives & pats on the back, appreciate 'em ;) But I never would have reached this point, or learned all I've learned, without the kind souls here at V Dr. I love this place!

lgbpop: OK, I'll do that. I wasn't sure what to set the BIOS at till I could locate my old settings. When it's time, should I just leave it at Optimal then?

stevejr: You work like I do! :D 'What's next on the agenda?' Tearing my laptop apart to get to the CMOS battery, which I've discovered is buried under the motherboard, and requires almost complete dismantling. I started a post in the laptop forum awhile back, Train helped me with it, but I chickened out. I found what appears to be a bootleg gateway manual on the web that shows exactly how to break it down tho. (I had emailed Gateway to ask where the CMOS battery was. Their response was that they don't share that info with the general public, but for a mere $300+ they'd change it for me. That also included a required release to format the HD if necessary. I said 'no thanks'.) So that will be my next nightmare, and I'll be glad to share it with all of you :D

~Kat

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When it's time, should I just leave it at Optimal then?

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Unless you're into tweaking or overclocking, the optimal defaults will do you quite well.