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Hi,
my load has been further distributed over two machines by now.
the iwill got a IDE burner today, and it has the DVD. The spare SCSI subsystem is gone from Iwill.
I have put the hotrod in there, to allow for hard disk data recovery "attempt" operations.
all drives currently in there are single masters... even the removable tray bay...
(gotta be able to do data rescue/ghosting on failing drives/on machines to be rebuilt)
the SCSI burner hdd and cdrom is in the big one, with free connectors, and a bit of power to spare.
(as I said, I have re-distributed stuff)
so far, I see no power related glitches.
when the time comes, I just get me bigger drives...
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Remember, there is always something we forgot to ask.
And, it's only FREE advice!
Kind regards, Jaak
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Thanks jaak for the update. Yes, that looks good.
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..SCSI - do I hear someone calling my name..? Or is it just the wind playing tricks on my mind (SCSI, oh SCSI, where art thou..?). https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
If I may put in my two cents here on SCSI: Right, SCSI harddrives (& CD/DVD) are costlier than ATA, but right now the prices seem to be going down, at least for the smaller hard drives (9 GB & 18 GB). Not to a level comparable with ATA, but it's a good start.
Having experienced som dire trouble with ATA drives lately, I'm once again turning to the - in my humble opinion/experience - more reliable SCSI drives. In my time with computers I've had 3-4 times more failures with ATA drives than with SCSI. I can't tell why that is. The mechanics can't differ that much, right?
The difference is primarily a question of different interfaces. It may be that the higher price is due to better quality - I'd like to think so, but don't know for sure. In fact, I've only had one SCSI drive gone bad on me in 6 years (I'm currently running 4 SCSI drives and have a couple more lying around waiting to switch places with ATA drives). I've even had sparks flying from a SCSI drive - it's still running, now in it's third year.
I recently did a little testing with a IDE (ATA66) and a SCSI DVD drive, both of them rated at 12 x. I did the testing while the machine in question (2 x P3 600 MHz/W2K) was quite busy doing something else during the test.
W H A T A D I F F E R E N C E I N S P E E D when used for real!! The SCSI drive was able to rip the contents of a DVD to harddisk about 4-5 times faster than the IDE drive. At no time did the reading speed of the IDE drive get above 3x. The SCSI drive averaged a speed of 7x.
I know, I know, it's not really a fair and scientific test - but it's the sort of test that I can use, since that is how MY system runs quite often.
I think that if you really want/need speedy drives you have to go SCSI all the way. Not just the HDs, but the CD/DVD too. The speed of SCSI really comes to play when all data transport can be handled by the SCSI controller. ATA can not run data both ways at the same time as SCSI can. Try connecting a HD and a CD burner a master / slave to the same ATA controller - you're running the risk of buffer underflow. Connecting a SCSI HD and CD-burner to the same controller will give you no problems.
SCSI controllers often have an external connector for scanner, zip, camera , what have you...and a decent SCSI controller will give you room for up to 7 or 15 devices to be hooked up. ATA, well, 4 devices and off you go to buy an additional controller card. Ok, now we're talking power user/system - not the avarage system.
Still, there's the price question. A SCSI DVD drive will probably cost you 30-50 % more that a comparable IDE drive. Larger (> 20 GB) SCSI HDs will cost you a lot more than ATA drives. So the trick seems to be to put the right mix together in your (power) system.
I'll still buy SCSI drives/devices anytime when the purpose is to move large amounts of data fast.
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Karl, Denmark
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"..and may The Force be with you - too..."
[This message has been edited by kallikru (edited 09-01-2001).]
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GG1,
I'm too lazy to go back through and read everything...where do ya stand now? What's the latest on the parts list...any changes?
And of course the most important question...are you going with the current MYST 3:Exile or are you starting at the beginning with the original MYST? https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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Hell hath no fury like a computer scorned.
MAXXIMILIAN'S
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Good Morning All, After lengthy studying and price comparisons, the info you all have provided, I will change my MOBO to AMD. Now I have to determine what speed but am leaning towards 800 to 1GB. I will stay with the Inwin case. I believe I gan get a MOBO and CPu for under $200.00.
maxx, I have two 40GB HD and RAM. Ordering case, MOBO/CPU this weekend over the internet. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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Hi Goose,
I installed a 900 Duron in "Lazarus"...so far so good. Pretty inexpensive, too. I bought it as part of a mobo/CPU/HSF combo, so I might have gotten a small discount, though. No heat problems and I haven't even installed any case fans yet. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ Don't tell Train and Bistro, though...they will yell at me for insufficient cooling. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
SSSSShhhhhhhhhhh........
Case fans are in the works, though. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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Hell hath no fury like a computer scorned.
MAXXIMILIAN'S
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https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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GET THOSE CASE FANS IN THERE RIGHT NOW, YOUNG MAN, OR NO DESSERT FOR YOU!!!
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Hi,
yes, a bit of forced ventilation can do wonders to get "trapped" hot air from around the heatsink.
few weeks ago I saw a fairly well made, good value "budget" case which already had a built in second case fan, right behind the area where CPU is normally found. (plus it has room for a front casefan too)
claims a 300 watter too, but 250 sustained is more like it...
all in all, not bad for less than Bfr 2000
(around 40 bucks) and good enough for budget systems.
now, about CPU..
my only "gripe" with duron is while multimedia multitasking.
otherwise, a good budget solution...
I'd take a Piii anytime.
But, then you have athlons (hot buggers both in terms of sales and temperature...)
and, the new palomina on DDR is said to handle MM multitasking a lot better, but I don't have it firsthand.
Haven't had much time on my athlon lately, but will soon throw some real world multitasking jobs at it.
the iwill VD133 with its "feeble" piii-EB600 is still my workhorse.
(before anyone jumps to conclusions, I have to again mention the VD133 needs the USB filter. It's a truly versatile mobo none-the-less.)
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Remember, there is always something we forgot to ask.
And, it's only FREE advice!
Kind regards, Jaak
-
MAXX
Your britches are fixin to get HEATED up. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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You won't regret AMD https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
Just built this yesterday:
Idle 38Celius +/- 2 degrees
Win98SE
[email protected] 266DDR Tbird
256MB PC133 Generic Ram
IWILL KK266Plus
VolcanoII/Radio Shack Paste
Matrox G450 32MB AGP
30GbMaxtor 7200RPM ATA66
Generic 16" Case/300watt DEER PS
Case fan blowing outward
6-4-24x Creative CDRW
No Floppy
Altec Lansing ACS54 Speakers
Replaces the one in my sig(some parts were swapped over)
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Tripleboot Win95b/Mandrake7.1/WinNT4
PII266
192 megs ram
30gb Maxtor PrM
4gb Quantum PrS
Creative Dxr2
Creative 6424
Sound:SoundBlaster PCI64 integrated
Video:Matrox G450 32MB
[This message has been edited by wonderinguy34 (edited 09-03-2001).]
[This message has been edited by wonderinguy34 (edited 09-03-2001).]
[This message has been edited by wonderinguy34 (edited 09-03-2001).]
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Hi All, Question 1. Is there a list of current recommended resellers anywhere?
Question 2. After several hours research am leaning towards An Abit KT7 Socket A Raid MOBO with a T-Bird 900 CPU in an Inwin case.
Looks like I can do alot with this setup including using Raid 0 (mirroring HD)
Now I need your comments and constructive criticism. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
Plans were changed by my better half this weekend. Had a labor day picnic (which I enjoyed).
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Goose,
If you are going to go with AMD I would reccomend getting a mobo that supports ddr memory. There is not much of a difference in price and it allows for much more upgrading in the future.
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Hi caeser, Why? And your recommendation? https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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And the day came when greengoose approached and saith, "Master, cast not your anger against me for what I am about to do, but let me find mercy in your sight. I leaveth this Land of Pentium and travel forth unto the Valley of Athlon to seek my destiny. Please, my master, give me thine blessing, lest I shall leave in misery and sadness."
And bistro saith, "Thou art on thine own, kid..."
--from the Lost Annals of Bistro
https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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...and in the land of AMD, did the denizens come forth to welcome yon weary traveller. What is thy name did they ask of the forlorn and wandering man? And he did answer...for I am Greengoose and I have come to join thy flock. Will you welcome me? And with that did a loud roar erupt from the gathering...so as to break the clouds...
Welcome Greengoose...to the land of AMD.
Come...let us offer yon weary traveller, food and drink and thus plan his adventure before us. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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Hell hath no fury like a computer scorned.
MAXXIMILIAN'S
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And bistro could hold back no further and sent a messenger to greengoose. And when greengoose saw the messenger approach, he saith unto him, "Hail!", and the messenger saith back, "Hail, yes!!!". And the messenger proclaimed, "Thus saith the Master: If thou seekest thy fortune in the Valley of the Athlons, be wary. For the heat there is as the fires of Gehenna. Seekest thou the best cooler and procurest thou an abundance of case fans; for then thou shalt have success."
--from the Lost Annals of Bistro, Appendix B
[This message has been edited by bistro (edited 09-03-2001).]
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ROFLM*O
Maxx , bistro
https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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Train, They speaketh the truth. Now they have me doing it. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ It does not pay to ask a simple question for you might become riddled with parables. I been up to long. Nite all. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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...and a perplexed Greengoose did come upon of the peasants of AMD and he did tell of his master's message. And lo...they were steeped in awe. For they kneweth the wisdom proclaimed by the Pentium master was the truth. The fires of Gehenna did burn in the land of AMD and Greengoose would endeavor to face the fires. "Fear not", they said. "for your master has opened your eyes to the pitfalls, and being forwarned, you may walk in the path of the four winds. Nestled in their arms shall you go forth, sheltered from the fires with the breeze upon your brow. Stray not from the breeze and thou shall thrive in the land of AMD."
Greengoose thanked his new friends and parted ways...and was given a Talisman to protect him in his journey. Onward he travelled, grasping his Talisman that the peasants had called Arctic Silver. He shall then proceedeth to the tree of fans and plucketh thy ripest fruit as his master had instructed.
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Hell hath no fury like a computer scorned.
MAXXIMILIAN'S
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GG1, here is my latest system that I have recently put together, I can’t recommend it enough, it’s not overclocked in any way, the only adjustments I have made are to the memory timings in the bios.
Motherboard-Epox 8K7A+
CPU-Athlon Thunderbird 1.2 266 FSB (38-42C)
HSF-GlobalWin fop32-1 with Artic Silver 2
Memory-256 Megs of PC2100 DDR
Video-Creative Geforce2 Pro 64 Meg
Sound- SbLive value
Modem-Cheap Intel
HDD-IBM DTLA 307030 (Master on UIDE1)
DVD-Panasonic DVD 116 16 Speed (Master on IDE1)
CDRW-IomegaZIP 8x4x32 (Master on IDE2)
PSU-400 Watt
Sandra Results
DVD-6592
HDD-24482
Memory-614/802
CPU-3361/1643
CPU Multi-6496/8163
3D Mark 2000-8190
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I wouldn't get too concerned about cooling Durons/Athlons. They can be cooled just fine without any extrodinary measures. They really don't "require" (under normal settings and use) any special heatinks, pastes, etc. Sure they dissipate more heat. But I honestly haven't found it to be a problem.
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The Prophet from New Joisey...er..Jersey hath spoken. As he hath said, so shall it be written...
Agreed. No real need to panic, but if it were me, I'd want to cool that sucker down as much as possible. But again, there's no need to put a wind tunnel on that thing.
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Good Morning All, Please keep the comments coming. What about the chipset? Stable and dependable? Read 28 individual reviews on this MOBO and only two had something negative to say. I could not find any negatives in the benchmarking tests and comments.
DrMDJ, This MOBO has the capabilities to do quite a few things according to what I have read. If you have the time, in addition to the heat point brought up what else is there against this board in your opinion?
For all of you, I did not get the MOBO and chipset ordered as I was planning to do this weekend for the simple reason I am a little gunshy and hesitant to order because I don't want to make a mistake. And there is much more info to go through than I realized. This is my first build and if I had all of your collective experiences that you have had in all your builds, I probably wouldn't feel this way. This is a feeling maybe most first time builders have and I felt that it should be mentioned. Ah well, it will come. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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At least I wasn't called the prophylactic from Jersey (yet).
Goose, it is just time for you to come over from the dark, I mean Intel, side. It is prophecy that you will become the Yoda of the Athlon. it will be you who then trains young Bistro-walker in the ways of the true (aka AMD) force.
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[This message has been edited by DrMDJ (edited 09-04-2001).]
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GG1,
Which board we talkin here?
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http://www.boomspeed.com/bistro/CoolLion.jpg Bistro shall stay in The Land of Pentium and chill for now...
Frankly...I'm getting a real kick out of watching AMD and Intel fight it out; just makes for better chips to choose from. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ Keeping a watchful eye on the Northwood.
GG1: Are you still talking about the Abit KT7 Socket A Raid mobo?
[This message has been edited by bistro (edited 09-04-2001).]
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Bistro, Nice picture. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ Where did you get the sunglasses.
DrMDJ, The Mobo is an Abit AMD Socket A Ultra DMA 100 Soft Menu TM III & RAID 0/1/0+1 Technology @ $155. Prices are still headed south looks like.
We are in a manual mode at work so am having to work extra each day. Everything is by hand now. Don't ask my opinion on this situation at the moment.
Will change over threads tonight and by the way I am backing up at least once if not twice a day. I save by each page. Links too. Working out pretty good. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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You're right Bistro, it is a trip to watch. Ya get something like that from Intel, then something like this from AMD, then..., then... Back and forth, back and forth. But people keep buying the things. Gotta have them. Afterall, it just won't due if yours is bigger than mine.
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https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ "Chip envy"? Gotta love it.... https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
GG: Might be prudent to go with an AMD chipset board. Been reading a little too much of folks having some trouble with Athlons and VIA chipsets. Just depends....
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I read last week about Intel demonstrating a P4 running at 4.0 GHTZ. My biggest problem with Intel is the pricing structure. Once they get some more reasonable prices, I'll start looking at Intel processors again. Personally, I like my P3 and originally wanted to go that route, but the duron deals were just to good to pass up. As for motherboards, the Epox board mentioned above seems to be a popular one. Seems everywhere I go, I see people using it. At this point I cannot reccommend my ECS K7VMA. The board works great and the price was right, but the strange setup for power management has got me confused. I still don't know for sure if my machine is really off when I shut down...LOL https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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Hell hath no fury like a computer scorned.
MAXXIMILIAN'S
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Bistro, Thanks, that's just the kind of info I'm looking for. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
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And greengoose sent a message to the master asking what he should do. And the master saith to him: "Just depends"." And greengoose was filled with joy and awe at the master's response. The master just scratched his head and saith, "Now what did I say?".....
---from "The Prodigal" section of the Lost Annals of Bistro
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This is the Block Diagram of the AMD 760 Chipset.
http://www.amd.com/products/cpg/athl...rchdrawing.gif
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That looks strangely like the Wash DC MetroRail map....
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Interesting review on that chipset. Pros and cons.
Anybody got any good articles on just how much performance advantage there is to DDR? The article above appears to be somewhat negative towards it. Could save GG1 some bucks...
[This message has been edited by bistro (edited 09-04-2001).]
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I've seen stuff to indicate a potential performance gain of up to 20% with PC2100 vs PC133 could possibly be had. But the reality of things is that most usage patterns coupled with the demands of current applications don't come close to utilizing the bandwidth of DDR SDRAM. As a result it's probably more realistic to expect something in the 5-10% range at best.
Might GG1 benefit from going the DDR SDRAM route? In my opinion probably some, but only some of the time.
One of the main reasons perhaps to go the DDR board path now is in terms of being more aligned with the future upgrade strategies. Non-DDR is not the way things are going to be slanted towards. But then again, the way things are changing now, is it even possible to hope to truely have much of an upgrade path with anything bought today?
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[This message has been edited by DrMDJ (edited 09-04-2001).]
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Have to agree. Wondering if they're getting to the point of diminishing returns...performance increases appear to be dropping. While benchmarks can be a good indicative tool of performance, I think most end-users are looking for naked-eye speed. Not gonna see much of that with what's coming out lately. Can anyone here actually see the difference in Quake between 90 frames per sec and 110 frames per sec? Don't think so....I for one won't spend $50 to $75 dollars more for a vid card just so I can get those non-discernable extra frames.... https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ And how much is the average user into multi-tasking? A 2ghz processor may be great in the work place (depending on the work)--wouldn't knock it--but at home?
If I open three or four programs and they come up in a flash and operate quickly, what's a 2ghz processor gonna give me that a 933 doesn't? At this point, just bragging rights IMHO. I think someone somewhere is going to have to come up with some hardware that is totally original--operates on some totally different principle that blows everything else out of the water. (Perhaps quantum-based?). Otherwise, we're just gonna have to be satisfied with 5,10% performance increases (and that's all relative).
Soapbox now unoccupied..... https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
[This message has been edited by bistro (edited 09-04-2001).]
