Virtual Dr. seems more than a little sick: "Member Participation Issues"

Kep it coming folks,keep it coming. :)

When delving into computer knowledge, the subject can and will become very deep and heavy very quickly. Therefore a little humor can be very welcome. (A visit to Bistro's mounrain can become scary though. :D )

You can be a jack of all trades and master of none or become very narrowly focused and speacialized. Goes with the game I guess. Personally I like the jack of all trades route as you can get a taste of this and that. How everthing works together is fascinating to me. For others there interests are more narrow. Everyone is different. This site caters to all. Which makes it so interesting maybe.

The intimidation factor is real as in life around you. Again human nature from one to another is different. One of the things to fight this is that there is no dumb question when you are trying to learn.

If you have a question that comes from your brain, ask and if you have a comment that comes from your heart say it. This site can become as good as each member wants it to be and that means key it into your computer and post. It is as easy as that.

Only one comment on post counts. It is the quality of the individual post that really counts.

We could have not gotten this far on this thread without some fine participation.

And for those that have not posted. How are you going to get anything if you don't speak up? Can't and others cannot really voice your opinion, how you feel, what should be done.

For me, I miss detrailed discussions and debates if you will. Some of the best knowledge I aquired over time has come from that very thing.

This thread is becoming long. What twelve pages now? I am going to try and compile a list of points that have been brought up so we don't lose sight of any ideas or suggestions. Then maybe we can SEE WHERE TO START with all this to achieve what has been brought if achievable. Alot to accomplish with what has been said. Maybe some W O R K too. :D

This has got to be the best durn thing anybody has started on this site as now we are talking Virtual Dr. :)

Hmmm. I do hear and can accept your argument there Linda that post count might be useful when it comes to identify a new member/participant at vdr. It's just that beyond this post count as far as I've ever seen is not an indicator of any sort of knowlege or ability or how right/wrong an answer someone gives is. And I do feel I see (have seen) quite frequently where there a)seems to be a greater "validity" given to a respondent based on post count, or b) seems to be that intimidation factor that KatMac mentioned (in terms of questioning, challenging, posting perhaps an opposite or contradicting response). And when it comes to catering my responses, I always do that solely based on my "read" of what's said by the question asker. It's been more than once that I've seen people posting their first time here be on a level (knowledge wise) above posters with many, many more posts.

As for assigning "levels"... I assume these would be self-assigned. That certainly can have it's pitfalls too.

In the end I think ya have to really just read the posters question, make a judgement, tailor your answer, and if you miss the mark then the poster can come back and tell you they didn't understand or you confused them. And if they do, then you regroup and try again.

I, for one, have not ever been intimidated by certifications of "experts", nor have I ever been intimidated by any members of this site. Not to take away from those who are knowledgeable and have a variety of certifications, but a long list of letters after a person's name does not necessarily mean that the person "has a clue" or "gets it". Certifications without real world and/or work experience in the area of their expertise means nothing. I'm sure we all know or have known persons who were geniuses in book smarts, but in "common horse sense" knowledge, didn't have sense enough to "come in out of the rain" and were usually severely lacking in people and relationship skills as well. Not that I'm not impressed or don't respect people that have spent a lot of time and money to get their certifications and experience, but one should be able to "walk the walk" as well as "talk the talk". All of us here at the VDR community have our own unique perspective, knowledge, and skill sets as well as shortcomings and weak areas which could be improved upon. Kinda like any other community.

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Originally posted by 104456
Just to pick up on something you said there Frums [very good post by the way]:


Perhaps someway theres a way we could incorporate an experience field into the user info under the avatar i.e. beginner,intermediate,experienced or technician then those that respond could pitch it at the level of the poster ?

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First of all thanks to all that have participated so far, we have gotten some great input.

As far as eliminating the post count, bad idea, we have a lot of members who pride themselves on what they have done to help out here and are proud of thier post count as it reflects that they have spent a lot of time doing just that. However the the user titles can be changed, but doing it thru the forum software as it is now would make anyone who just joined an intermediate, experienced or tech according to the post count. We do have members that are computer experts when they join.

Members can choose a title when they first sign up & it will overide the forums default settings but getting everyone to do that is another problem. I believe the upgraded software allows members to choose what level they feel they are & shows it in thier user name area. BJ

All,

I just visited cybertechhelp.com for the first time. I did not read any of the threads but I did go to every section and here are my first impressions.

On the plus side:

• marketing their site first,
  tutorials,
  Other Resources -- Tech Dictionary, Free Online Virus Scan, Services

On the negative side:

• Poor website design,
  Poor Forum layout,
  Inconsistent interface behavior

Conceptually, the best thing that cybertechhelp is doing is marketing their site and services first, then having ads. The thing that CyberTechHelp really did better was how they handled first time visitors to their site and computer newbies.

This site did have a Windows 2003 conference. I went to that forum but none of the thread topics was particulary enticing, nor did I have a lot of time to read a number of different threads.

Once VDR gets beyond the VBulleting upgrade and homepage redesign, then I think that there I think that VDR might consider adding features for the new member and for computer newbies. The tutorials and tech dictionary are also nice touches.

VDR is still the best IMO.

Just my impressions.

Cheers,

Linda

:D

terminology On the subject of terminology used in answers: this was a hurdle for me to oversome, especially earlier on. Some of the abbreviations used and terminology I just didn't get. (When I first got the internet I thought LOL meant "lots of love") :rolleyes: No wonder it seemed cheezy and didn't fit within the context of what was being said. :) And still not everyone gets that stuff. My sister (a full time mom to two little ones who's terrified of her PC) just asked me last week what "LOL" meant. She received an email from an Ebay purchase she made that went sour, thought the sender's reference to "LOL" meant "lots of luck", which promptly sent my sister through the roof :D Get into technical abbreviations, and it could be really confusing.

hmmm. Maybe we could overcome some of what we see as 'givens' and offer a page here or sticky somewhere that includes technical and 'net abbreviations that would be helpful to newer members? HD, M$, MB, Mobo, IMHO, my .02 ...

intimidation factor rednek tek broaches this from the other side of the coin. And I admire your ability to zip right past what might intimidate others. (Just goes to show how different personalities take different approaches.) Although I've done ample rattling here, a little part of me feels like I'm going out on a limb each time, because I'm shy by nature. Loathe public speaking. Lots of us like that. Depending on the degree of introversion, posting and conversing alone can indeed be a real "hurdle". But as discussed previsoulsy, even to those who aren't introverted to any degree, there still can be factors that intimidate. And it would be nice if we could get to a place, somehow, that some of he more tangible intimidation factors can be removed and make it easy for members of all personality type to breeze on it.

concise answers My own method has been to try to make a concerted effort, when posting, to be clear, concise and spell it out (i.e. using bulleted lists and do a step-by-step). That's gotten reactions ranging from rainshowers of gratitude to 'jeez, lady, I'm not stupid'. ;) Personally, I prefer to err on the side of offering too much than too little, and be sure that it's clearly spelled out. The search function, just based on input in this thread, is a heavily used feature (that's good!) and one never knows when a newbie will stumble upon it in a search. Then again, as Doc mentioned, once communication gets going in a post, then responses can be more readily tailored to the posters level.

Post count &. levels: hmmm and another hmmm. Could be walking through a field of landmines there. Lots of pros and cons being brought up. What if we just did away with the whole deal, or partially do away with it? On posts display our user ID, date we joined and location on the left? (Mods and Admin still distinguished as such). And to satisfy those who want to keep their post count or for benefit of the curious, maybe post counts could still be included in the member's profile page? That's off the cuff, haven't given in-depth thought. EDIT: I see BJ's post above now, so maybe this one won't fly. ;)

I also don't think eliminating the post count is a good idea.

When I see a mod or member with a lot of posts, I think, wow, look how many people he/she have helped. It's kind of a recognition for a job well done.

All this coming from a guy with 70 posts.LOL.

On post counts, my take is that it is just information that other members can use or nor use as they see fit. Some people add more weight to post counts than others, but I can't see any reason why including the information can ever do any harm. I also like the idea of members being able to state their experience level, it is something that is definitely possible with Vbulletin3 and is done on another site that I'm a member of. Again it's just extra info for people to use as they wish.

Some sort of glossary of terminology is a really nice idea, there certainly are some difficult and obscure terms and abreviations when it comes to computers.

I truly hope that new members aren't intimidated, though I do still remember the first time I ever posted (on the old NoWonder forum), and how nervous I was at at the time. I don't know what the answer to that is, personally I always give new members a welcome, but other than that it's hard to see what can be done.

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Originally posted by DrMDJ
Whew! Thanks for not mentioning me directly by name.;) :D

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Dude, when it comes to bad speeling, grammar and all out bad english I think I take the cake.

I also use the post count. If I see an obvious spam post like "win a free bagel slicer! Here's how!" and it's the user's only post, I figure them to have signed up just to spam. Now it's true that I can find their post count in the admin panel, but it's quicker this way.

I too like post counts, as if that wasn't obvious.

I agree with the concept that posts in the lounge's off topics don't contribute as I think that it means that our post counts represent posts to genuine "help" related topics.

I think that there are people on other sites such as CTH and Techsupportguy that have built up massive postcounts just from posting to off topics which could then mislead people into thinking they are some sort of guru when really they are not.

I'm also a member of sites that don't show them and I actually find it really annoying that I can't see easily how many posts I have made http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewto...416&highlight=

Maybe we should introduce a feedback system similar to eBay eg based on a rating for responses etc http://feedback.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayI...nix.0&frm=1883

Like I've said, at the end of the day I put little value or meaning in a post count. Nonetheless, whether they stay or go is VERY low on my list of concerns.

The feedback system that Nix mentions has been introduced on our sister site at www.vbforums.com

They call it "Reputations". Here is their FAQ on how it all works:

http://www.vbforums.com/faq.php?s=&d...l&titlesonly=0


Speaking personally, although I like that site, I'm not crazy about the idea myself. But it wold be interesting to hear what everyone thinks about introducing something along those lines here.

I guess it's a bit like rating threads on this site.


Rarely gets done but it only takes two people to give one a 5 start rating and it's got 5 stars.

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Additionally, there is reputation POWER. Power is the number of points you give each time you rate a post. This starts at 1 point, but increases based on a number of criteria such as posts, tenure, and your own reputation. Additionally, when you give negative points, they are at half of your power level.

Here are some other rules and settings for reputations(which are subject to change):

* You must give reputations to a number of different people before you can come back to the same person again. No giving just one person all your points!
* For every 4000 counted posts — so not including chitchat — you get an extra point of reputation POWER.
* For every year you have been with VBForums, you get an extra point of repuation POWER.
* For every 1000 points of reputation you receive, you get an extra point of repuation POWER.

In addition to the above rules, you must also meet certain criteria before you will be able to start giving points. Until these criteria are met (or any time they are not met), then you will have an effective power of 0:

* You must have at least 20 counted posts.
* You must have 5 points of reputation yourself (everyone started with 5, so you have to lose points in order for this to impact you.

Please be aware that leaving reputation points may not be anonymous.

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The above from the site SS linked to.

Sounds complex, more like a Yugioh or Pokemon duel or Dungeons and Dragons for the older members.

To me the "reputations" would seem to provide nothing all that worthwhile.