Two machines, one connection?

Hi all,

With the addition of my new machine I just built there are now 2 machines in the house, the new one for me and my wife's use, the other for the kids.
Currently my machine has modem and kids do not. I have given printer to them as they need it more than I do.

I'd like to be able to set this up so they both can go online independent of each other as well as share a connection at the same time.

I thought of a nic card, but guess both machines would have to be fired up if the modem is connected to other machine. I also would like to keep file access separate.

External modem?

Ideas?

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

Are you on a cable or a dialup? With cable connection you need a router or hub. And install nics in both computers. Don't install Netbui and folder sharing in networking. As for a dialup check with your ISP for multiple users for your password. If you can get ICS to work with a dialup modem your connect will be very slow if both are accessing simultaneously.

Netfish,

I'm on 56k dialup. The primary use for the kids would be surfing the net for school research and I'd like to be able to stay with forums while they do so. I realize pages will load slower.

I'd save dowloading files for during solo times.

I thought of NIC cards, but think both machines will have to be on in order for networked machine to dial up with modem in other machine, Problem is my machine is password locked in BIOS to keep kids out for good reason. ( too many unexplained sagas)
They can crash their own machine.

Get the idea?

Any ideas to go about this?

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

To share independent of each other:
use an external modem with a switch.
You would not be able to share at same time this way, though.

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Trust in God -or-
Click HERE to Delete! the God Monster!

Please check out Starbucks forum (link on my site).

Ethernet card.

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I only got one hit in three years of little league baseball.

Hi, what about laplink cable?

I'd recommend NIC too (hell, I did) but can this be achieved by a reasonably cheap solution like laplink?

have freebie cdrom I'd be willing to send to Steve, with full proggie version 7.
even have one such cable.
(have NIC cards and coaxials too, but gonna need these whenever I get aruond connecting my own)
jeesh, I just realised I have all this stuff laying about, and never used it.
I gotta start finding out things... https://discussions.virtualdr.com/

so, what about laplink?


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Please remember, it's only free advice...
Kind regards, Jaak.

I run an ICS network in my house, and I do not have to open up my machine for my kids to get to; in order to have the networking be effective.

I set it up using NIC cards (one in each machine), I have 6 computers, and a hub, and switch to make it all tie in together. The kids can get online, and they don't need to get into my machine at all, this keeps the security tight on mine. I have a cable modem, but when I had dialup it worked the same then too. Mine was not that much slower at the time with the kids, and me on at the same time either.
I would go with the NIC in each machine, then use a hub to link together. Kids do not need to get into my machine to do the online thing. Just set up the ICS on the machine with the modem, and it will guide you from there. (You need to have Windows 98SE, ME, or 2000, on the machine with the dial out.

Hope this all helps out.

thanks ecrosson,

That sounds like what I should do, Jaak mentioned Nic cards, but I thought my machine would have to be on in order for the kids to dial up with my modem.
Saw in a few catalogs NIC's sold as low as $12 each.
What is the purpose of the hub? A switching device?

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

Install NIC cards in both computers and network them.. You can setup your computer network such that no one can get into it. Download proxy.exe from analogX.com easy setup... The proxy allows your kids computer to dial the internet through your computer.. the kids can now access the net through your computer and still have protection.. I would also download zonealarm for addition protection from the hacks out their in the internet world.

I have 5 computers networked, the kids cannot get into mine or my wifes computer and yet they can dial out. Everyone has been online at once and really did not see a big change..

Good luck,
amathis

Amathis,

Thnx.

Downloaded it and have it in HD ready to go.

Gonna see retailer as I heard he got a cache load of used computers from a company, maybe he'll have some NIC cards and cables cheeep.

What's a HUB for? switching device? will I need it for only two computers?

Oh yeah, I asked this Hub question earlier. No replies?

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

No if you go with cat5 cable you can make yourself a crossover cable (or buy one) and connect the two computers.

Otherwise if you are using coaxial cable you don't need one either.

Though I would recommend using the cat5, nic cards are pretty cheap at staples (less than 20 bucks).

Troy

You don't need a hub, A hub is so you can connect more than two pc together, that's all it's for. I use one because I bought a network kit, it came with a hub, two nic's two cat5 cables and the drivers. Cost $60

What you want is two nics and a cross over cable, you don't need a hub unless you want to connect more than two pc's.

I have cable and I share with ICS, my host is always on, If you use ICS with your Setup your host, will have to be on.


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Companies would rather lose you as a customer than fix the problem
Vampirefo

Just a thought to add to what others have said very well. I have a 3 machine network and decided for my wifes sake and she was right to put a new supra modem in her machine as well.

Now we don't depend on the same modem for connections and she and I share printer, zip, ditto backup, etc. and with a simple line extension she doesn't need to have everything fired up. Total cost for the Supra $40.00 Splitter and line $5.00.

It gives us the best of both worlds. Privacy, sharing, power saving and we can both work at the same time.
Just a thought.

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"Finest Kind"

griffinspc:
can you explain a little more concerning the line extension. With the line extension can two modems dial out at the same time with the line extension. First time I have heard of this (very good alternative).

Thanks,
amathis

I think what griffinspc means is both machines have their own modem, so both do not have to be on for connection from network to host.
but if both are to share connection, the network machine has to connect to the host machine's modem.
Sounds like a good idea.

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

What about peer-to-peer network. Does both computers have to be on at the same time to use the Internet?

Sorry i don't know much..but a suggestion to others.

Peer-to-peer means that both computers are independent from each other. Each computer can have their own set of rules.

By the way u want to set up your network, I think it's server-to-peer. So the server is your computer and the peer is your childrens' computer.

The server much be on at all time to allow the peer or client to use the Internet.

If you knew all this already then peer-to-peer might be a good choice if it works.

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"The point of living, and of being an optimist, is to be foolish enough to believe the best is yet to come." Peter Ustinov

Sorry to be so late with this but duty (work) calls to often.

Quote:

---

I think what griffinspc means is both machines have their own modem, so both do not have to be on for connection from network to host but if both are to share connection, the network machine has to connect to the host machine's modem. Sounds like a good idea.

---

That's about it. As far as the question from amathis, what I did was put a $2.00 spitter at the point just before the jack on my main PC where the outside line connects. At that point I used a 15 ft line cord through the wall to my wifes machine, the same hole that the cat 5 wire runs through for the network, and plugged that into her modem socket.

This allows her to only boot her machine and dial out in a normal manner when I'm not there and not have to mess with my machines and switches, hubs, etc., which she hates.
There are other times though that both of us need access (really rare now) and though I do find it quite a bit slower we can access together.

At first I was concerned that the splitter and extra line cord would degrade the signal but I had 49,333 before and 49,333 after.

No, both modems share the same line so they can't dial out at the same time operating independent of the network. You would get the error that there was no dial tone if you tried.

Obviously this entails purchasing a second modem but they are really cheap now and then it's a question of still wanting a network. I'd still say yes to that for you because you want to share a printer and there are a lot of advantages besides that. Backups, storage, file sharing, sharing periphials (sp) and just gaming between you and your kids.

As many have said you don't have to give your kids access to your machine and the easiest way I've found is not to allow drive sharing on yours but you may do it on your kids depending on the type of supervision you want on your kids surfing habits. If they have the printer and you need it you can share that still.

Last I would, as someone below mentioned, get Zone Alarm before sharing anything even with an isp connection. With just 2 machines you just need the nic's and a crossover cable for your network. How far you want to go after that is up to you. I hope I haven't gone to long with this. It's hard to remember what I said without scrolling up and down all the time. Good luck.

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"Finest Kind"

Aopen AON-325 with 15' crossover.

both cards in and cables connected,setup old machine.
Diagnostic shows passed I/O register and loopback test.
With other machine, loopback test failed.

tried reseating, then finally swiched cards.

now both cards fail loopback test.
new board damaging Nic card?

Got network Neihborhood on both desktops, but cannot make use of NIC.

RTFM tells me nothing in way of troubleshooting and setup networking.

whatamidoinwrong and whatdoido?



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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

Did you try switching the cable end for end? Could be a bad crossover cable.

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There are no dumb questions only dumb looks....

If it doesn't work hit it with a hammer. If hitting it fixes it great! If it breaks, oh well it didn't work anyway.

Crossover?

Hmmm. I'm wondering this...

As it was made up for me.

are color lineups supposed to be the same on both ends?

they appear to be different.

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

Look here!!!!!
http://www.makeitsimple.com/how-to/dyi_crossover.htm

They are different at each end for a crossover, the colors don't matter just if the pairs are matched up right.

Check this out Wiring Tutorial for 10BaseT Unshielded Twisted Pair (UTP)

Remember colors aren't as important as matching pairs!

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There are no dumb questions only dumb looks....

If it doesn't work hit it with a hammer. If hitting it fixes it great! If it breaks, oh well it didn't work anyway.

Well it's morning, I I'd like to overview, when one is tired one does tend to leave out details.

The loopback test I mentioned in diagnostics is in on board diagnostic program, I do not think it is related to connection to other NIC or cable. which makes me wonder if I did static damage during swap, as I thought ( mind you I was tired) loopback test passed with the first machine after setup.

Now both machines fail loopback test after swap as I suspected card in new machine may be bad, so I swapped expecting the old machine to fail loopback test with suspeted card and "known" good card to pass in my machine. but now both fail.
Led's interact when other machine's are turn off/on.

I tried network diagnostics, and set one to test as Initiator and other as responder, Responder waits and intitiator waits for responder, and initiator's machine activity light blinks rapidly.

To me, it looks as it has no trouble transmitting, but does not recieve.

Also, there has to be more to getting networking to work than just putting cards in and install drivers.

Or is it supposed to be that simple?

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

Look at these threads and see if they can help with your problem:

http://discussions.virtualdr.com/Arc...-2-016267.html http://discussions.virtualdr.com/Arc...-2-015863.html http://discussions.virtualdr.com/Arc...-2-015059.html http://discussions.virtualdr.com/Arc...-2-014810.html


amathis


[This message has been edited by amathis (edited 03-03-2001).]

Hi all,
Had a busy morning with errands and stuff, My wife came home from her early morning run with her mother and I told her of this issue. Jessica used to work for tech support at a large SQL based software firm using breeze systems and knew about setting up networking for their clients, but after a year leaving this firm, she has forgotten the routine.
Anyway, Just before she came home I went into Control Panel> networking and checked file both sharing and printer sharing boxes in both machines and reboot ( for the hell of it)at reboot, clicking on network niehborhood shows both computer names listed on my machine. but on kids machine, nothing.

I swapped cables around to rule out bad cable, if it was bad, kids machine would see mine, but I would not see theirs.

No change, so cable must be ok.

Next, Jess took over and typed winipcfg in run box and made note of IP addresses in both machines and made note of Subnet mask.
she set xxxx.xxx.xx.xfor IP and xxx.xx.x.xxfor subnet both both machines.

On the kids machine she set WINS Configuration to Enable WIN Resolution and typed xxx.xx.xx.xin the boxes. In DNS Configurationshe chose Enable DNS with Host name KIDS and input xxx.xxx.xxx.xxxin the box ( should that last one be 0?)

The above WINS and DNS values were not applied to my machine

anyway, there are no changes.

Jaak sent m an e-mail, lengthy one too, I'm going to read through and see if I can apply changes again.

I wish I can find a site that shows a step by step walkthrough on setting up a network from beginning to end.

Jess said there is indeed more to networking than just throwing in a couple cards with cable and install.

I was afraid of that....

But how else can one learn, eh?

Geez, not too long ago I learnd DOS... poor
Jaak...

Edit, removed Ip posted for reasons.

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

[This message has been edited by stev-rey (edited 03-03-2001).]

[This message has been edited by stev-rey (edited 03-03-2001).]

steve,
the stuff in that email came largely from the four threads amathis posted.
by filtering I meant I speedread it
and pasted some parts...
you bet there is cool stuff in these links........

the screenshot you mailed me said one of these cards is using IRQ5?
(since you could mail screenshot, I assume it was from the card in new machine, which will not network...)

made a table of screeshot
you could maybe make a table of the other card
machine XXXXXXXX showed

AOPEN AON-325 Setup and diagnostics version 5.01 2000
-----------------on board diagnostics----------
Node ID .................... removedremoved
Network Speed .............. --
I/O Base ................... B800 H
Interrupt .................. 5
Full-Duplex ................ Disabled
Cable connection ...... .... Disconnect

...............................Pass count..........Fail count
A.I/O register ..........593.....................0
B.Loopback Test ..... 0.....................592


[This message has been edited by jtdoom (edited 03-03-2001).]

hehehee
https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ poor Jaak https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
PLS, don't make me laugh, PLEASE, NOT NOW....
https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ ouch! my ribs... https://discussions.virtualdr.com/

IRQ 5
this one could very well conflict with soundcard or on board sound.

just about all links above have a few good tips and links in them
here are a few more http://hdallen.home.mindspring.com/ http://www.homepcnetwork.com/ethernet.htm

win95 http://corp-reflection.com/pub/peer/

stuff on netstat http://blacksun.box.sk/netstat.txt

you see, I wanna learn from STEVE in this...
poor steve https://discussions.virtualdr.com/




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Please remember, it's only free advice...
Kind regards, Jaak.

Jaak,

That screen shot I sent you was from new machine, and old machine does the same.

And it was old machine that would not network.

New machine sees both machines in network Neighborhood.

I thought old machine passed at loopback test, but I could have been just seeing things... new stuff is hard to remember when I'm pretty much working in unfamiliar territory. ( I'm sure you all can relate to that, unless you are autistic)

To bring you up to date, I followed that step by step link Jaak mentioned and removed the configurations Jess put in, iow, I started all over again from scratch.

Resulted in same scenerio as Jess's setup. except on kids machine, if I right click on Network Neighborhood and click on Find Computer and type in the name of my computer, it finds it. also if I type in the name of the kids computer, it finds it as well.

In a way, it "sees" it, but not in Network Neighborhood.

I'm getting closer, but somthing is still missing... gonna do some more reading.

Help would be appreciated.

gotta feeling, Im gonna fumble with getting kids machine to network correctly...

then fumble to get them online.

Oh, BTW Jaak, my machine has no sound card attached, so it probably assigned to 5.

I will change slots at a later resort, Nic card is in slot 2, next to vid card, but book says it is unshared slot.

Another note, slot 6 has a different slot than the other 5. they are all PCI slots, except #6 is has thinner connector, I thought that was odd.

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

the thin whitish is indeed PCI slot 6

the one at the far end is CNR 1
aka communications network riser slot 1
(other type card, on page 28)
I don't think this is a problem.

I'd assume it shares with slot 4, so put the card in there?



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Please remember, it's only free advice...
Kind regards, Jaak.

Not just yet Jaak,

I'm not gonna ever say I won't listen to you and may indeed move to a different slot. ( I know there is good reason too)

But good news, Primary Logon was Microsoft Family logon, and I changed both machines to Client for Microsoft Networks. it needed CD and reboot.

Got rid of kids own desktop and passwords. rebooted again.

chose one of the kids names and typed in their own name as a password, now they have desktop with a password I can access.

Now I see both machines in Network Neighborhood!

Snoopy dance, pop a beer, clink bottles, high five.

NOW....

Iv'e got to get this network to WORK.

So I can get the kids online

And set it up so I can access their files for supervision, but stay out of mine.

What's next?

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

Hi,
at least you knew this is out of my league..
the others should be told this aint my area...

YO GUYS!!!

https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
it's getting somewhere.


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Please remember, it's only free advice...
Kind regards, Jaak.

O.K. now....

I should say what I have,

In network Neighborhood, both machines show computer Icons named Dad and Kids.

clicking on them opens a blank window.

also if I right click network Neighborhood, there is this map network drive.
you choose a drive letter from G: upwards and type in a path.

whatdoidonow?

There has to be someone out there who knows the routine...

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

Hi ALL,
are there other steps to do before win98's internet connection sharing is enabled?

I think that from your machine, you may want to link to network printer.
is that safe to do?
does that open a vulnerability?

I think you at least need a shared directory on kids, say for scanned stuff.
hell, I dunno.
but I know I wanna do all of this on a later date.

aha, found good tutorial on internet connection sharing
1 startpage http://www.zdnet.com/pcmag/pctech/co...u1815.001.html
2 how it works http://www.zdnet.com/pcmag/pctech/co...u1815.002.html
3 step by step http://www.zdnet.com/pcmag/pctech/co...u1815.003.html


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Please remember, it's only free advice...
Kind regards, Jaak.

I just realised steve is using First edition.....

FE does not have internet connection sharing built in

anyone know cool modem sharing tools?


[This message has been edited by jtdoom (edited 03-03-2001).]

MANY thanks to Jaak for that link to All aboard program he found for me, as FE does not have ICS and full install of IE5 did not give me that option either.

The kids machine can now access internet.

This setup is really cool.

I can transfer files to the kids machine from My hd with a blink of an eye, really fast.

Yet, they can't do jack getting into my machine, unless I let em.

I still have some tweaking to do, I'm having a bit of trouble getting the kids machine to dial up when modem is not connected.

but if I dial up with my machine, the kids can jump in and surf away.

Does not seem to slow down much either, gonna see about that now, I got a ton of Windows Update to do.

Thanks all, case closed, and good learning experience.

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

[This message has been edited by stev-rey (edited 03-03-2001).]

hoorah, it's a TWIN
https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ https://discussions.virtualdr.com/

gonna get me some stuff to get me hair back.
dark abbot's seems to do wonders

sure, it's even true.
the more tummy I get, the more hair I see.......

lets see some guys at the Mach2 show.

Hi Stev-rey,

I'm sure glad that you posted this thread! Because of it, it generated an interest in me that I had never tried before. Consequently, I've installed a second NIC in this "main" machine that I have a cable modem on. Then I popped a NIC into another "secondary" machine here, and just now finished installing ICS. it took a few minutes of "tweaking" to make it work, and it is really cool to have both machines using the cable modem! Heck, I'm as happy as a lizard on a hot rock! https://discussions.virtualdr.com/ Thanks again!

Happy computing! https://discussions.virtualdr.com/

Limerick
https://discussions.virtualdr.com/

Hi all,
when I searched for a solution to this, I came across all aboard! SE 2.2

all aboard is not freeware.
does anyone know of a freeware which does all aboard does?

Jaak

Jaak,

Amathis referred Proxy.exe from www.analogX.com and I think this does the same thing. except it must be configured manually as opposed to automatic install with all aboard.

I think.

I read through the readme in proxy.exe and it is kinda foriegn to me.

Really, setting up a network is simple when one figures out how it is done and have the resources to help you.

without those links that Jaak and others provided, it would have not been possible.

Ever tackle a problem with no idea how to go about it, and find when you are finally done, you feel like a dumb ass because you thought it was difficult.

Simple procedure, really...

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It's either that or it's into the woodchipper

jaak
I am using a linksys BEFSR41 router for cable access. Easy setup and no slowdowns. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/
Now for the Home network settings. Maybe tomorrow. https://discussions.virtualdr.com/

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SMILE
and post back