DSL with Login or Cable w/o Login - Is Setup Different?

[Mike in Orange]

I have set up a few home networks for friends/family but always with a broadband connection that did not need a login. A friend now wants me to set him up but he's using SBC/Yahoo DSL and it requires a login. Does anyone know if this will impact the way the setup works? I mean, if he has to log in initially, what happens when computer #2 wants to connect and #1 is already logged in? Wouldn't the login show that the account was already connected? Or am I overthinking this and I should just plug everything and fire it all up?

Thanks in advance.

[104456]

but always with a broadband connection that did not need a login.
???????they all need a log in of sorts or you cant get a connection.
Usually either through a default dial up connection with user name/password if its USB or user/pass in the internal configuration if its a router.

Can you be a bit more specific on the hardware you are using?

[Mike in Orange]

???????they all need a log in of sorts or you cant get a connection.

Not true. I have RoadRunner Cable through Time Warner at home and all I do to connect is launch any old web browser and I'm surfing the net. I launch Outlook and I'm downloading email. My friend (using SBCYahoo DSL) has to connect first with a user name and password or his browser comes up empty and his Outlook can't reach a mail server. This is where I'm wondering if he'll have a problem "logging in" with two different computers at the same time.

By the way, all the networking hardware will be Linksys equipment. I've used their wired and wireless equipment to great success many times and setup has always been a no-brainer. I've never setup a system that required a login first though.

[jslater25]

Mike -- You are correct, more often than not a DSL or Cable modem won't require the user to login each time he/she wants access to the internet. And you are also correct that Yahoo/SBC requires a login. Odd to me, and yet another reason to hate SBC. However, there is a light at the end of the tunnel. I recently setup Yahoo DSL for my grandmother, and know that there is a possible way to connect without always being asked to logon. I will check her settings and let you know how to do so (cant remember off the top of my head because its a rare case). If I remember correctly, there is a small launch window that you have to push "connect" in order to login. There should be an option on the toolbar to automatically connect, and there should be a way to automatically minimize that window into the systray.

Just know that there is a way to auto login. The only thing I haven't fixed for Granny is Outlook Express asks for a login! But I currently have the fix for that, so all is well. Sorry I couldn't be more specific.

[PcWilliam]

I am not sure if you said yes or no to the router question, but if you have a linksys router you can literally delete all the software including the dialer for SBC off of your computer.

There is an option within the router were you enter your PPPoe username and password that you created when setting up your SBC account. If this is done no matter how much you disagee you will never have to login again.

The only reason you should install the SBC software was to creqate your username and password after that it is just a waste.

[PcWilliam]

SBC
If you have SBC's "WinPoet" or "Enternet300" software (PPPoE) installed on your computer/s you need to uninstall it. Click on your "Start" button, go up to "Settings" and then over to "Control Panels". Go to "Add/Remove Programs" and double click, find "WinPoet" or "Enternet300" and remove it.

Next, go to http://192.168.1.1 in your web browser. Leave username blank, enter "admin" for the password. Once in the set-up page, go down to "PPPoE" at the bottom of the page. Click "Enable" and enter your SBC Username and Password into the appropriate slots. Click on the "Apply" button and you are ready to go!

[104456]

[
There is an option within the router were you enter your PPPoe username and password that you created when setting up your SBC account. If this is done no matter how much you disagee you will never have to login again.

Yes I quite agree with this setup there is however a log in by the router and if the router is powered down it logs in again when repowered.

I have never heard of a system where one does not have to log in in some form or other be it the NIC MAC address tied to the ISP in some form or other or a User name/password required.
After all if you do not give ID how does the server know you have access rights?

But that is for another discussion.

[PcWilliam]

Point Taken

I have never is my many many times installing DSL with Linksys Routers ever had to enter the username and password for a MAC or a NIC.

If the router is powered off the dsl will not work as you said but if that is the case why have a router.

Also I am sure you know this part but if the router is config. with the DSL username and Password any client computer can just plug in the CAT5 cable and get internet access

[104456]

I have no wish to disagree with anybodys logic in any way and I have not used any other system but UK adsl.
But let me put it another way who in there right mind would enable an ADSL system and disable security so as not to require a valid log in of some kind, to at the least prove they are the actual bill payer i.e. by the router log in,the NIC MAC address or by a dial up access complete with with a unnneccesary number?
There must be some form of ID to identify the user to the ISP.

[PcWilliam]

Oh its a fight you want????

Just Kidding, you have helped me in the past with some of my issues I do take you suggestions serious.

I think for DSL here at least the number is changed to analog and is specially configured for DSL by the ISP so the only way to access the ISP's service is to enter the username and password. That is the only information the ISP would need right? Do they care how many people are accessing the service.

In the original post he did say is was for home networking so I am sure the Bill payer can make these changes.

I hope that was not as confusing as i think.

adsl?? I wonder how much different it is compared to DSL.

[Mike in Orange]

There must be some form of ID to identify the user to the ISP.

I thought there would be too, but with my Cable hookup there was no software to install, no settings to configure, nothing. Even after adding a new computer to my home network all I did was plug in the Cat5 cable and away I went. When I converted to a Linksys wireless router so I can add my new laptop to the mix (and work from the comfort of my hammock in the back yard!) again all I did was shut everything down, plug everything in, and it just plain worked!

As for the pointers specific to setting up an SBCYahoo connection, I just can't tell you (PcWilliam & jslater25) how much I appreciate your input. This should go a long way toward getting my friends system setup in no time. And jslater25, I look forward to you confirming the specifics of the autolog in.

Thanks again everybody. Man, I love this place!

[Rapmaster]

My cable ISP logs the MAC address and associates it to an IP, but I can punch in whatever MAC (or switch to a different network card etc) and still get a connection. It's not "logging in"


They control access through filters on the cable line and other ways that I don't understand. There are also some code numbers in the modem's ROM. But from a user perspective, you don't need to do anything but plug it in.

DSL will more commonly require PPoE authentication. This is done by whatever device is directly connected to the modem. If its a PC, you use PPoE client software (or Windows XP's built-in one.) If its a router, use the router's built in PPoE support. The PCs behind the router don't know or care that it is a DSL connection. They just see a network connection to the router which acts as a gateway to the Internet.

[PcWilliam]

RapMaster

Good post that is exactly whati meant but you explained it much better.

[104456]

OK I admit defeat you guys are just too big to fight with :D :D

I hope the situation works out for the best.

[Mike in Orange]

DSL will more commonly require PPoE authentication. .........or If its a router, use the router's built in PPoE support.

So Rapmaster, if I understand you, I can set the PPoE in the router and the router will always be "logged in" so to speak, and the individual computers will just need to launch a browser or email client? Would this router log in happen automatically if the router loses power for any reason?

I'll be doing this install over the weekend, so I'm gathering all the ammo I can between then and now. Looks like I'm getting some really good stuff here!

[Rapmaster]

Yes. The router will actually keep the connection alive so you don't need to worry about it. Many models even have a setting where you can tell it to re-establish the connection (log in again) every x number of seconds/minutes. Or you can let it connect upon demand, if the connection has timed out or something. It's pretty much transparent to the users at the PC.

If the router mentions anything about "cable/dsl" on the box, its a good sign that it has PPoE support. (I haven't seen a model that doesn't.)

If the router loses power, it will still retain its settings. There is some kind of battery I guess. It might lose it after a very long time but its not terribly hard to set up again. I've never had to reconfigure my router (I don't use PPoE but there are a bunch of other settings stored in the router.)

On Linksys routers you need to set the connection type to "PPoE" on the main setup page [see attachment pic], before it will give you the boxes to enter name, password etc. Generally the manual for the router should describe everything =)

[falcon2000]

I am NOT good at these stuffs at all. I am just wondering rather the debate of having to login is simply a superficial one.

This is what I mean:
If you configure your router with all the login info, then, true, the login process will be transparent to you (being done in the background by the router) but doesn't the router is still "logging in", so to speak? Like the DSL I have at work, each time I launch the browser the first time there is a delay, I suppose the router is logging in???

At home I don't use a router. However, my DSL software has an auto connect option. You setup the user name and password once; tell it to remember it; tell it to auto connect. Then when I launch the browser the first time for the day it will log in but I don't have to do anything (i.e. not having to put in the username and password.)

Aren't they the same after all? Isn't the only difference is that one prcess (without a router) is NOT transparent to me (I see it logging in) while the other process (with a router) is transparent to me (I don't see nor know that it's logging in) ????

The above is a NOT a comment. It is a question as I don't know much about this kinda of thing.

[Tuttle]

You're right falcon2000, you log in either way, and if you have an underlying provider whose authentication servers frequently crash (grumble...Tel$tra...grumble) they're both prone to the same problems. I guess the advantage with a router is it doesn't need to be rebooted nearly as often, so provided your line quality is alright you stay connected much longer, are much more likely to keep the same IP address for long periods etc. You also don't notice auth system failures as often. :rolleyes:

For anyone who's interested, there is also a form of DSL service which doesn't require a username/password login, called RFC1483 bridging. It's a fairly expensive way of doing it (you use at least 4 IP addresses for each client instead of 1), so it's pretty much only used for business grade connections. Configuration at the client end just consists of plugging in the ADSL modem, configuring the PC/router (real router, not one of those home ones) with the static IP address info and using the connection.

[104456]

A quick search of their homesite gave this

You have two installation options-self-install and tech install.

Self-install comes free with most of the SBC Y! DSL packages-your self-install kit will arrive in the mail 7-10 days after you place your order. Included will be everything you need to install your new DSL service- a DSL modem, line filters, nic card (if necessary), Ethernet cord, and a Quick Start Guide and installation CD to get you up and running in minutes. The CD contains step-by-step instructions, as well as necessary software: a SBC Yahoo! Browser, SBC Yahoo! Instant Messenger, SBC DSL Connection Manager, SBC Yahoo! Utilities, SBC Yahoo! Parental Controls, Internet Explorer 6 (if you do not already have 5.0 installed).

The self-install option is recommended for almost all subscribers. SBC and Yahoo! have worked very hard to make self-installation quick and easy. And if at any time, you experience problems with your self-installation, we're on the phone ready to help you-a special customer service phone number will be provided in your installation kit.

With the tech install options, one of our trained service reps will personally visit your home to install SBC Y! DSL. This service costs $200 and includes installation of SBC Yahoo! DSL service via an existing telephone jack within your house.

So you should be a ble to refer to the self install manual or helpline in the unlikely event you get stuck.

[falcon2000]

Personally, I don't see why having to login is such a big deal if the software has the "auot connect" function, it takes all but a second.

I used to have SBC before it is SBC/Yahoo. Sad to say though it was really lame. Down all the time. Often had to wait a l-o-o-o-ng time for phone support and when they did answer the phone, many of the techs knew less than I did. 90% of the times they would just ask you to re-install the software even though the problem was at their end, LOL! Hope things get better now.

Anyway, when I was w/ SBC their software had the "auto coonect" function also. Actually, it got quite a few more functions. You could configure it to auto connect and launch IE all at the same time automatically at computer startup. You could even add a sound file of your choice to play it when IE launched. Quite cool!

[104456]

This is how my router logs into a UK ADSL ISP

[Now to see if I get the images downloads right :D ]

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid60/p1357d5f273baf30a77f07e10f20e1e9d/fc3fb635.jpg

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid60/p4bc99e9ae304a259cc186571631d83aa/fc3fb633.jpg


So in essence the router modem is permanantly logged in to the ADSL line unless disconnected manually and the PC`s merely use it as any other internal network router via a self configured or DHCP IP address.